Chronic IBS plus Bacterial overgrowth? HELP!! PLEASE! How do I manage it?
#371131 - 04/22/14 09:06 PM
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Ok, so I have sever IBS D for many years but recently had extensive tests that showed severe bacterial overgrowth in my gut. They cannot find any good bacteria AT ALL.
The thing is though, the Dr has recommended the GAPS diet, some of which I can do but the lack of any grains is ridiculous as I need plain pretzels to stabilise my gut, yet every single Dr I have spoken to has said I need intensive probiotic therapy coupled with a no sugar no grains no dairy diet.
Now dairy is an issue for me anyway, but I don't know how to restore my gut to perfect health while still being IBS stable.
I have benefiber supplement which is wheat dextrin and take digestive enxymes as my pancreas is not making any.
I am also malnourished and very anxious and restless. I want to heal my gut and get that good bacteria back in there but how can I do that when I need to eat my sourdough bread and plain wheat pretzels??? I am so scared I am never gonna get rid of this.
Some Drs are saying once the good bacteria balance is restored which they said can take YEARS I wont have IBS anymore, others said i may still have IBS but one thing is for sure-if I continue eating sugar, grains and any dairy my gut will remain bad. 
I am confused and I don't know what on earth to do.
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Something you say does not make sense. It is impossible to not have any good bacteria.
Was this test done by a conventional doctor or a naturopathic/alternative medicine doctor? What kind of test was it? A blood or stool test? The reason I ask is there are no known test to check if you do or don't have good bacteria as there are over 1500+ different kinds of bacteria in the colon. And to date only about 500 or so are known. Something doesn't make sense. There is a breath test of small intestine bacteria overgrowth but it is not very accurate. Presumably this was not the test you had.
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
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A qualified General Practitioner who specialises in digestive disorders ordered blood tests and extensive tool testing. This was done by collecting entire samples of stools over three days on one occasion and then again on another.
They looked for any kind of microscopic good bacteria and could not find any but found copious colonies of bad bacteria and undigested carbs, meats and fats.
The Dr has years of experience as a specialist in digestive health and has recommended the GAPS diet or at the very least ,no dairy and gluten.
However, IBS symptoms makes this a tricky thing to tackle as I am being told that wheat and dairy will exacerbate the "bad" bacteria and to get my gut thriving again I need intensive probiotic therapy along with a very clean diet.
However, while I do think dairy and gluten make me think foggy and I am extremely anxious aswell, I believe that when my tummy hurts soluble fibre supplements like Beneefiber and plain wheat pretzels help me.
I cannot fathom not having any grains at all or not being able to at least have the sourdough bread or pretzels.
however, the Dr says that while they may tame my tummy during IBS attacks, it's a catch 22 as it will feed the bad bacteria and my gut will never properly "heal" until I get rid of gluten and dairy..possibly all grains.
I don't know what to do. I want to follow Heather's diet guidelines while also getting the good bacteria back. The anxiety is very severe and I feel depressed. I have to take digestive enzymes as tests showed my panccreas is not producing the enzymes that break down my food. I am also malnourished despite being overweight, and am down in major vitamins and minerals and iron.
I fee like absolute crap and I want to help myself but I don't know what to do exactly. How do I tackle this without being sensitive every day as the recommended diet for me at the moment is organic meat and vegie broths with probiotics leading onto more foods but NO grains or at the very least, no gluten.
Any advice would be much appreciated. This is the 4th Dr that has told me that my tests are pointing to bad bacteria overgrowth and possibly "leaky gut" but no one is sure if that even exists. One thing all the Drs and specialists agree on is that I do better taking digestive enzymes and probiotics and staying away from dairy and gluten.
But how do I actually stay 'IBS safe" while cutting out all that wheat and dairy etc? I mean how many of us IBS ers could actually survive on food?
ALso worrying is I don't want to go crazy and my anxiety get worse or my gut-brain to effect my head-brain more. Does that make sense? Really scared and freaked out. Want to eat the right things for my best health of gut and brain to thrive.
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There are lots of gluten free grains, and gluten free soluble fiber options.
One thing that makes no sense to me about the diet info you're being given is that it disregards the fact that it is the fermentation of soluble fiber in the bowel that feeds healthy gut bacteria. How are they expecting you to get soluble fiber?
And meats are just plain terrible for bowel health, whether you have IBS or not. Red meat increases the risk of colon cancer - it is not going to lead to healthy gut bacteria, or a healthy bowel, so this also makes no sense.
Are they answering your questions with detailed info or pointing you to references to support their advice? You have every right to ask for and expect that.
XOXO
Heather
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Heather is the Administrator of the IBS Message Boards. She is the author of Eating for IBS and The First Year: IBS, and the CEO of Heather's Tummy Care. Join her IBS Newsletter. Meet Heather on Facebook!
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I can have root veg and rice and cornmeal but I need something to take on the go as a soluble fibre base to fill my tummy and I usually do that with pretzels. The gluten free pretzels here have dairy and weird ingredients. So I guess I'm just trying to figure it all out.
My specialist said the GAPS diet is pretty hardcore but thinks in the long run would be best for me and there certainly seems to be a lot of people that have had their anxiety etc helped from that. And I guess that is what scares me. If I just go gluten free and don't exclude all grains will that mean my brain will get worse, not better? I don't know what to do. All I know is my gut is all messed up as is my thinking and I want to do the right thing but it's all confusing.
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GAPS diet
#371143 - 04/25/14 04:32 AM
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Syl
Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5499
Loc: SK, CANADA
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Perhaps it is time to look for another doctor  There is no clinical evidence at all the GAPS diet will help with IBS. And there are no stool or blood test that will tell what bacteria you are missing or have too much of that is causing IBS. This doctor sounds like a integrative medicine holistic doc not a conventional western medical doctor. It might be wise to talk with a GI doctor and ask what s/he thinks of the approach this doctor is using. It definitely not something a knowledge GI doctor would likely recommend.
"The GAPS diet reflects serious gaps in Dr. Campbell-McBride's reasoning and in her understanding of science. There is no published evidence to support it. The early introductory stages may not provide adequate nutrition; the full diet is probably healthy but is onerous. It seems very unlikely that it could accomplish all that is claimed. Without testing, there is no way to know whether it benefits or harms patients."
GAPS Diet
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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No she's a western Dr and she even works with the likes of the local GI specialist at the hospital. I went to see him and he was very dismissive of the IBS-basically said something called colon-eze might help and I told him I felt digestive enzymes helped me.
He told me unless I was dying of pancreatic cancer that couldn't possibly be true, but I have now had further tests that show I am not digesting meat, carbs or veggies properly and am deficient in pretty much everything .
My thinking is all messed up and i am constantly exhausted.
I've been to four or five western GPs all who have said just to avoid foods that trigger IBS and have lots of immodium or gastro stop.
That's fine-but when pretty much everything makes you sick how do you define what to have exactly? I have had numerous stool tests all from different Drs who have said my body is very acidic and full of bad bacteria, which they believe is making the gut more sensitive and more prone to IBS.
It kinda makes sense to me that if you restore balance to it it might get better. The CFS/FM is really severe and I don't want to get worse.
It's not like these are naturopaths or holistic healers. THey are GPs that are western doctor that have chosen nutrition as their expertise field and have years of experience.
They have said it's not normal for people to suddenly not be able to digest things our ancestors ate like meat and fish and healthy fats. I react to all of them as many people with IBS do I'm sure.
What I don't get is why some Drs just say take immodium and avoid triggers but don't look further as to why we are like we are.
Shouldn't we have more answers by now? Think about it...our ancestors would have had meat and fish and vegies and herbs and at least some grains and lots of animal fats.
I don't digest any of that very easily at all.
Why can't anyone help me find what is actually CAUSING the IBS and my fatigue and brain fog etc?
I'll follow any diet they want me to if it makes me well. But I also don't want to waste any more time. It hurts so much and I feel like life is slipping me by.
It seems that if a Dr does have interest in nutrition they always say I am acidic and have very bad bacteria in the gut and that if we heal the gut I'll be able to absorb more nutrients. It's not normal to have to have all your nutrients via shots because your tummy doesn't absorb them.
And then there are the Drs who just don't care, say take immodium and just avoid all food pretty much.
How do I find that happy medium? I don't know what to do.
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Re: GAPS diet
#371145 - 04/26/14 04:15 AM
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Syl
Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5499
Loc: SK, CANADA
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Here is what baffles me. Any doctor knowledgeable about GI disorders such as IBS would be fully aware that the GAPS diet has no clinical evidence to support its use. And they would know that the FODMAP diet developed by the GI group in Australia is the only diet that has been clinically shown to be effective for managing IBS and other functional bowel disorders. However, there are some western doctors that have gone to the dark side and started practicing integrative medicine -- an approach that integrates western and alternative medicine. These doctors do strange blood and stool tests and recommend alternative things like the GAPS diet. If you are not familiar with the FODMAP diet read this article by Kate Scarlata - a registered dietitian with IBS/SIBO who has written and consulted on the use of the clinically proven FODMAP diet for managing functional bowel disorders.
FODMAP: Road Map for IBS
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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Thanks. I have started hydrogen breath testing for possible fructose and other malabsorption to things like lactose etc...so it will be very interesting to see what that shows.
I agree it's very hard to know what Drs are doing these days. I have been told I have the SIBO and that seems to be their main concern.
That specific carbohydrate diet was also bandied about. I am on a lot of probiotics but I am going to the Dr this week so will bring up all these questions and see what the Dr says.
I guess for me the proof will be in the pudding. If I can find a diet that helps me live a normal life it'd be wonderful but I am aware some Drs have their own agendas aswell. I'll post back when I know more. I am also getting more results this week.
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Could you try substituting plain rice crackers for the wheat pretzels? Sesmark has some brown rice crackers that are very simple (just rice, oil, salt, rosemary oil although there's no rosemary taste). They are small but not fragile and would be easy to carry. There may be other brands available, but I eat those frequently. I also can eat San-J brown rice sesame tamari crackers even under stress, but you might have trouble with the seeds although I don't. Generally I find I can tolerate rice any time, even under tight deadlines (I'm a stress non-eater...)
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