Not getting much help from EFI diet - any suggestions?
#367926 - 07/26/12 02:55 PM
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Hi everyone,
I was just wondering if there are others on the forum who haven't had a lot of success with the EFI diet.
Don't get me wrong, obviously these guidelines work wonderfully for so many people and that's awesome.
I first stumbled across this site quite a few years ago and have gone through long periods of scrupulously adhering to every EFI dietary guideline. Plus, I bought the fiber, increased my dose very slowly as instructed, bought the peppermint capsules, fennel tea, etc.
And I do think some of this helped, but nothing seems to have been a game changer. I know that anxiety is a big component for me, and I have gone through periods during which I could get away with eating more or less anything within reason, and then many periods during which everything bothers me.
But, having said this, I still believe that there may well be some dietary factors that exacerbate my IBS, but I don't think these factors correlate perfectly with the EFI guidelines.
This is why I'm starting to explore other approaches such as the FODMAP elimination diet.
I was just wondering of there are any others on here for whom the EFI guidelines simply were not enough to get their IBS under control. And if that's the case, have you tried other approaches that have been more successful? For example, I know that there are some advocates of eliminating/reducing starch as a means of treating IBS symptoms.
Any other ideas or suggestions about alternative approaches?
Thanks,
Chris
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Hi Chris,
I did no-starch a couple years ago, and I have done low-starch (an elimination/detox diet), and now I'm trying this, and I just don't have a good answer. On no-starch, I felt overdone with meat and eggs. On low-starch/detox, which was actually a diet designed to reduce foods that commonly are responsible for food intolerances (no gluten, no dairy, no eggs, no soy, no corn, no beef, no nightshades, no processed sugar, no strawberries or bananas or grapes, no coffee, no alcohol), I was overdone on chicken salads and nuts. On Heather's, I feel overfull of white glumpy grains all the time. My IBS has seemed to be helped by all of them, to some degree, but I've also experienced flares on all of them. I quit no-starch because it was really difficult and I couldn't keep my weight up. I quit low-starch/detox because I wanted to try Heather's approach, and the detox diet says no white rice, no wheat, no potatoes (nightshades). That diet--I followed the elimination diet that the Clean program people follow--kept symptoms pretty stable, despite the vast amounts of insoluble fiber and fat (avocados, nuts, olive oil), and it gave me the best energy. On both no starch and Heather's, I feel a little sluggish. On Heather's, I'm thirsty all the time. Which has long been something that happens to me when I eat a lot of grains. I'm not convinced this is the best route for me, but I'm determined to give it a try for a couple months and see if I can reduce flares. Problem is, I'm like you in that I sometimes can go for months flare-free. Then I'll go for weeks where I'm flaring every few nights and there is no obvious trigger but everything seems troublesome. I, too, have an anxiety component. I'm in that phase right now, after a couple really rough weeks. Kicked off a bad patch with a cup of coffee, had two bad nights on our family vacation, a couple semi-bad nights since, and now if I so much as feel a twinge, I'm off and making myself nauseated thinking about how bad is this one going to get? It's hard to know what comes first. I'm thinking about getting those hypnosis CDs, but don't want to shell out the $89 right now when I'm still waiting to see how I do with the acacia I just bought! (The peppermint caps are going back--I felt pepperminted all day after taking one and I had what feels like acid indigestion or an ulcer for a few days afterward.)
I'm here tonight, so I'm violating my own round of latest thinking, which is that I tend to do better when I'm not overfocused on this IBS thing. The Internet is not my friend when I'm in flare mode; it just makes me more anxious. Been busy the past few days, and it's kept my mind off what might be happening in my gut. But I also kept my mind on it enough tonight that when we went to the fair, I opted out of any fair food. Drank water while everyone else had corn dogs and fries, then ate a hunk of (homemade) zucchini bread when I got a little hungry.
The FODMAPS lists don't clear anything up for me. On each of them, there are things I eat all the time with no trouble. And on each of them, there are things that have maybe caused me trouble in the past. Maybe. Sometimes. Never consistently.
Just wanted to comiserate. This diet stuff is so confusing . . .
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The FODMAP diet is a bit different than many other elimination diets. You may not have difficulty with foods in all of the FODMAP groups. For example, I cannot handle foods in 4 of the 5 groups while I can handle small amounts of foods from the other group. Also, during the elimination phase you remove all foods from all FODMAP groups. However, as time goes on you re-introduce some foods to see if they are a problem. The reason for this is that it is the quantity of a given constituent that determines if you may have a problem. For examples, some individuals cannot handle foods such as wheat that contain fructans while other people can handle a small or even moderate amounts. The FODMAP approach is not 100% eliminate forever. It involves some experimentation to determine how much of a food in a given group may be a problem. This might explain why you see some foods on the FODMAP unfriendly list that don't seem bother you. 
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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Quote:
I'm here tonight, so I'm violating my own round of latest thinking, which is that I tend to do better when I'm not overfocused on this IBS thing. The Internet is not my friend when I'm in flare mode; it just makes me more anxious. Been busy the past few days, and it's kept my mind off what might be happening in my gut.
For some people, not all, it is not about the diet or the food eaten - at least in my case and others I have talked to. When diets, supplements and other things are not helpful, it may be just the act of eating (anything) that sets the IBS symptoms going. Certainly there are foods that can trigger things, but if you are eating a pretty decent diet anyway, and still have that brain-gut connection, you are going to have symptoms.
For folks who do the hypno, we suggest keeping away from support boards and researching about IBS while doing the program. This is because the sessions re-wire the brain-gut connection and take you away from IBS symptoms and thinking. Most of the people who have done the hypno are no longer on support boards because they dont think about IBS anymore, because they dont have symptoms. This is good for them, but bad for those suffering who would like to know their story. People who come for support are those 'still' looking for the most part. Many many people are helped with IBS diets - but when that does not seem to be helping, hypnotherapy seems to be the avenue of last resort. Was for me - and that was 12 years ago, so thus I do what I do for those not to give up hope. Do consider it as another option - you can do it alongside any diet or meds, and NO side effects!
Happy to address any questions - read my story/journey below for some hope and encouragement ...
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My Journey and Success with the IBS Audio Program Hypnotherapy Program: www.helpforibs.com/messageboards/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=hypnotherapy&Number=224850
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I think only the lucky few are able to eat according to EFI guidelines and be symptom-free. There's the FODMAPS for one thing, besides Heather does not say that every single meal should have 25% of fat maximum and there are supposedly safe recipes on this board which call for say salmon and have greatly more fat than a quarter and propel me into so much pain that I can't express.
I recommend that you follow the four EFI rules (no alcohol, no caffeine, less IF than SF per meals, limited fat per meals) and the FODMAP guidelines simultaneously.
Safest foods to eat would be: porridge (cooked in water), boiled/baked potatoes, cooled rice, grilled chicken breast, shrimp, white fish, boiled carrots, peeled baked peppers, peeled cooked courgette (ie zucchini), tomato paste, orange juice, no-pulp-berry juice and a bit of fat with each meal (salmon/olive oil to mention two of the healthiest options, but do count the kcals here) (kcal coming from fat should be max 25% per meals: 1g fat has 9kcal, 1g carb has 4kcal, 1g protein also has 4 kcal). Incredibly restricted I know but I think you are extremely unlikely to have trouble from these foods and once your gut has calmed down after a week or so, you may experiment with adding different foods back into your diet one by one to see whether you can tolerate them.
See Syl's reply for that!
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now: stable through EFI+FODMAP dieting (no lactose/no fructose/some fructans and some polyols)
before: IBS-D(pseudo-diarrhoea), bloating, often unbearable pain esp from too much fat: Apr 2007- Dec 2010
FODMAPs: http://www.todaysdietitian.com/newarchives/072710p30.shtml
[I've tried VSL#3 -> I could tolerate v good amounts of IF (even with less SF), it worked great (but overall I find it too expensive)]
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Hi Susie,
Many thanks for your very helpful post.
Btw, I noticed the reference to VSL #3 in your signature. I googled it and see that it's a probiotic. Has that been very effective for you (more so than other probiotics)?
All best,
Chris
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Thanks for sharing dogsled. I can definitely relate to your frustration.
I have stopped taking the peppermint capsules as well. They were helpful previously, but now I've developed upper GI symptoms as well, and they aren't supposed to be good for that.
Not to push the hypnotherapy CDs on you, but that was the most effective thing I've tried on this site. I definitely had noticeable improvement in my symptoms. I repeat the program every couple of years - I'm overdue to do this, so maybe this will help me again.
Chris
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I did the hypnotherapy program some years ago and it definitely helped. I don't seem to be able to maintain these gains, but I have tried to repeat the program from to time to time.
In terms of doing the program, is it less effective if you listen to the session at night after going to bed (meaning that sometimes I'll fall asleep before the session ends)?
Chris
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Happy to help/share my experience, Chris!
VSL3 was really helpful for me, I could practically eat a lot more IF per meal than SF and pain/length of pain after accidentally overdosing on fat (v easy to do and still quite common for me and also v troublesome for me) was not as big a tragedy as it is now without VSL3. It is however extremely expensive, I'm now abroad so it's not easily available but even when back in Britain I probably won't revert to using it as I can't afford it. It only helps while you're on it, now that I'm no longer taking it, all my original symptoms reappeared.
Probiotics are really great and work for some, but can be quite pricey long-term, so it may just be a better idea to use a SF supplement (overall cheaper) and/or eat a restricted diet.
Three probiotics are most recommended for alleviating IBS symptoms are Align (Bifidobacteria infantis ), VSL#3 ( a mixture of bacteria) and Digestive Advantage ( Bacillus coagulans).
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now: stable through EFI+FODMAP dieting (no lactose/no fructose/some fructans and some polyols)
before: IBS-D(pseudo-diarrhoea), bloating, often unbearable pain esp from too much fat: Apr 2007- Dec 2010
FODMAPs: http://www.todaysdietitian.com/newarchives/072710p30.shtml
[I've tried VSL#3 -> I could tolerate v good amounts of IF (even with less SF), it worked great (but overall I find it too expensive)]
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Heather is the Administrator of the IBS Message Boards. She is the author of Eating for IBS and The First Year: IBS, and the CEO of Heather's Tummy Care. Join her IBS Newsletter. Meet Heather on Facebook!
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Yes, Heather is right. You can listen before bed, and since the sessions are only about 1/2 hour in length, you still get the message - Michael explains this in the introduction as well.
He also says, that you can change the time of day you listen, if you do not want to fall asleep, but to keep it the same time everyday if you can. Some folks opt to listen twice to their scheduled session, and this is fine as long as there is 6 hours between. You can get additional support if you need it. Some folks do decide to re-listen for a 'top-up' from time to time. This can be especially helpful to keep at your best for some.
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My Journey and Success with the IBS Audio Program Hypnotherapy Program: www.helpforibs.com/messageboards/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=hypnotherapy&Number=224850
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Cool - thanks Heather & Marilyn!
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I have had no success. I may keep purchasing Heather's tea's.
I'm finding the site healingnaturallybybee.com to be the best.
I have no more doubt.
I've started switching over to this program and already notice healing reactions and acid reflux isn't so bad and I'm not constantly wishing and craving for more fatty meats I couldn't have.
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ibs-D & bloating,mucus,gerd,incomplete evacuation.
diet-no preservatives,no table salt,homemade cooking,grains-sushi rice,rice flour,oatmeal,gluten&soy free
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