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Thanks Heather new
      #208276 - 08/24/05 07:41 PM
AmandaPanda, J.D.

Reged: 04/26/04
Posts: 1490
Loc: New York, New York

That really clears things up. I think I (and others) often confuse IBS-C with chronic constipation or just run-of-the-mill constipation that non-IBS people get. Thanks!

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Amanda

I live in the Big Apple, but I don't eat the skin

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Re: What are some examples of fermented foods? new
      #208368 - 08/25/05 07:57 AM
Johnny T. Reb

Reged: 07/09/05
Posts: 987
Loc: Lake Linden, Mich in the U.P. IBS-C

Hi Chris, Thanks for the info! So now then kefir may not necessarily be a trigger then? I like the stuff, I used to
drink it. One thing that is puzzling to me is that if your
condition is just due to a bacteriological imbalance, why
would you get spasms then? Also, what brought you to this
premise in the first place? Did your GI doc suggest it? Or
is it based on your own reading and research? Must be some-
thing to it if you're having decent success with your treatment. Now, are your spasms also subsiding as a result
of this treatment? I just ordered Brasco and Rubin's book
this morning from Amazon.com. I think I might go out and
get some kefir today too. -Bob

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<img src="http://www.math.mtu.edu/~rwkolkka/BritPicA.jpg">

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Bob, just remember.. new
      #208410 - 08/25/05 08:33 AM
Cyndy

Reged: 03/05/05
Posts: 1301


kefir is still dairy. So, if you decide to try it...maybe go slowly to test the waters. I think you can order non dairy kefir starters and add your rice or soy milk to it to make it non-dairy.

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Thanks for the info new
      #208429 - 08/25/05 09:00 AM
Cyndy

Reged: 03/05/05
Posts: 1301


Good luck with the diet and keep us updated. I have huge gas and bloat problems, so the thought of femented foods like saurkraut just about make me hurt just thinking about it. But then again, nothing else seems to be helping.

I don't think I could afford to order all the special foods either. Or, I wouldn't even know where to begin to make my own. Where to buy the foods or ingredients or appliances. Does the book give you recipes and sources of "special" appliances you need to make them?

I know if Rubin's book "Patient Heal Thyself" his diet requires very unusual and hard to find foods...maybe only found in California or special ordered through websites. I thought about trying his diet, but the foods were impossible to find and very expensive to order...or they weren't shipped to my area.

How are you doing with the Kefir? Can you buy that brand in a traditional store?

Are you also eating the Manna and Ezekiel bread that is recommended? That bread scares me with all the seeds, beans, etc...but then that's because it is so different than Heather's diet and it's difficult to change your thought process concerning safe and unsafe foods.

Also, fermenting is suppose to cause lots of gas and bloating...doesn't it just sit in your body fermenting and causing lots of gas? I thought it was better to eat foods that didn't ferment, whatever those may be. I can never keep tract of which foods ferment quickly and which ferment slowly and which are type are least likely to cause gas.

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Re: What are some examples of fermented foods? new
      #208438 - 08/25/05 09:19 AM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


I'm not looking at things through the lens of the IBS diet, so my perspective is going to be different than what is shared here. That's why I'm hesitant to say too much about it - I'm not really sure this is the appropriate environment to be discussing a completely different approach which contradicts what Heather says in many respects.

That said, kefir may or may not be a trigger for you. You'll just have to find out. And, you can buy kefir starter from bodyecologydiet.com and use it to make homemade kefir from rice milk (I don't recommend soy for anyone, anytime... see Jordan's book for more info on this).

Most of what I've learned comes from my graduate study of chinese and western medicine, the doctors and health care practitioners I've seen, books, extensive research and over 7 years of personal experience with this stuff. The bacterial dysbiosis is fairly certain when I consider the history and etiology of my condition.

Chris

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Re: Thanks for the info new
      #208441 - 08/25/05 09:22 AM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


Yes, following the diet can be expensive as you point out. However, if you make most of the cultured foods yourself (obtaining starter cultures on the Internet) and buy conventional produce rather than organic (making sure to scrub it with a produce wash before consuming), and canned fish rather than fresh... it's possible.

But as I said in the other post, I don't feel entirely comfortable discussing the particulars of other approaches here because this in a BB for Heather's approach - which I want to honor and respect.

Good luck,
Chris

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Thanks Maria new
      #208444 - 08/25/05 09:30 AM
Cyndy

Reged: 03/05/05
Posts: 1301


Does Benefiber contain a pre or probiotic? For some reason I thought you took Acacia.

Inulin scares me because Heather says if you are prone to gas or bloat to avoid inulin. I would eat Luna Bars and Teeccino, but I'm scared of gas and bloating.

I also read that FOS is a prebiotic, but that also causes gas and problems for IBS...

I'm so tired of being afraid of foods. I don't know if I should go ahead and try these food while still feeling gassy and boated and cramped. What do you think?

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Re: Cyndy new
      #208459 - 08/25/05 09:59 AM
lalala

Reged: 02/14/05
Posts: 2634


Benefiber is an SFS, so I believe it's also a prebiotic according to what Heather has said about SFS: "Probiotics are most effective when they're taken in conjunction with a prebiotic; a prebiotic (such as Tummy Fiber Acacia) is something that encourages the growth of probiotics. Soluble fibers often have a prebiotic effect, as their normal fermentation in the gut causes the production of beneficial short-chain fatty acids, which then lead to the growth of good gut flora. This in turn leads to a reduction (sometimes dramatic) in abdominal bloating and gas." So you can think of prebiotics or acacia/SFS as the food for the probiotics you get from soy yogurt: you're introducing the good microflora and feeding them so they'll thrive and flourish in your colon and take over any population of harmful bacteria.

You really want to know what I think? Well, I think being afraid of foods will lead you to unnecessary stress and anxiety that will then lead you to an attack so that whatever you put in your mouth will cause problems. However, I understand your fear because I've felt that way too. But I got tired of fearing food because I NEED food. Plus, I'm scared of ATTACKS and PAIN, which aren't always to be blamed on food--anxiety, fatigue, the mysteries of IBS are triggers as well. So, I'm trying not be scared of food; instead, I'm trying to be more AWARE of food. What I mean is, I follow the trigger list and avoid what Heather has listed as definite no-nos and I do my best to always have a good amount of SF.

However, when she has mentioned something, like inulin is a problem for some folks, I see that as information to alert me of this possibility (not a certainty) so that if I try it and experience more bloating, I can say, "Well it's probably the inulin" and move on. So I tested it out for while, prepared for the worst but hoping for the best. I'm glad I didn't stay away from inulin, because I love my Luna Bars and Teeccino!

I'm not really experienced in ways to manage C, but I think if you start incorporating more food, safely, into your diet and try to feel as relaxed as possible when you eat you might just surprise yourself. Have you thought about posting what you are currently eating/doing on the fitness board? Really, it's helpful to have people look over and point out things that might be bothering you. When I first started, I was eating raw baby carrots all the time and then Linz pointed out they would be safer if I cooked them. So I tried that and immediately found I had less pain! The same with regular oat meal vs instant. And Wind recently pointed out that a soup I've been eating contains MSG and casein, which showed me that I could have them in very small amounts.

I hope this helps a bit. I'm not sure I quite made my point about the difference between fearing foods and being aware of them.

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Thank you, Chris. I appreciate that you are concerned about this.. new
      #208462 - 08/25/05 10:01 AM
HeatherAdministrator

Reged: 12/09/02
Posts: 7799
Loc: Seattle, WA

it is important that this board keep a focus on the IBS diet, and not spiral out into a million different types of diets with totally contradictory information. I know this limits the board, but it also keeps the clarity. And goodness knows there are tons of internet boards already out there for the SCD diet, or Rubin's info, or Atkins, etc. I try really hard to keep this particular forum clear and consistent so people can get straight info about the IBS diet in particular, and not end up totally confused and overwhelmed.

Thank you again - I appreciate your consideration here more than you know!

- Heather

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Heather is the Administrator of the IBS Message Boards. She is the author of Eating for IBS and The First Year: IBS, and the CEO of Heather's Tummy Care. Join her IBS Newsletter. Meet Heather on Facebook!

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Re: Bob, just remember...Yeah, better safe than sorry new
      #208466 - 08/25/05 10:07 AM
Johnny T. Reb

Reged: 07/09/05
Posts: 987
Loc: Lake Linden, Mich in the U.P. IBS-C

Hi Cyndy, Yeah, I figured since it was working for Chris, and
she said a lot of people can tolerate it, I figured well then,
sounds good to me. But you're right she didn't say it was
absolutely ok. By the way, what are these kefir starters,
where could I order them from? I know they're not available
in the boonies here. I guess they don't need to be refrigerated? Thanks for bringing me back to reality. -Bob

--------------------
<img src="http://www.math.mtu.edu/~rwkolkka/BritPicA.jpg">

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