Mel Gibson's "The Passion of the Christ".....
#46741 - 02/26/04 12:18 PM
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Nugget
Reged: 02/10/03
Posts: 2167
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I was wondering what your thought are on this controversial movie. I have not yet seen it, but I am drawn towards it. I was not raised in a church, never read the Bible....but, I do believe in God. I feel I am a spritual person.....but not real religious...if that makes sense. I am probably going to buy the movie when it comes out on DVD and watch in the privacy of my own home with my husband.
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Hmm... I haven't seen it, and don't plan to. I'm not religious either and some of the content worries me... like the fact that Satan is portrayed as a woman, and Mary Magdelene is a prostitute. Also, I don't really like super violent movies, which I've heard this is. I think that's the biggest factor actually! 
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I'm seeing it tomorrow, so I'll let you guys know how it is. A lot of people at my school have seen it already and said that it was the most powerful movie they've ever seen. It really changed their lives to see it. My religion class was goign to go see it, but in the end we agreed that if you go to the theaters yourself on your own free will and let the movie sink in, it'll be more impactful. I can't wait to see it actually! I can understand where you're coming from, Jenny, about the gore thing, but I think that seeing how Christ died would be amazing. Anyways, I'll tell ya if it's like, extremely gory or what. We had to reserve our tickets a month ago because knew they'd sell out. Our theater is sold out for two solid weeks here. Maybe someone on the boards has already seen it and can jump in!
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It comes down to the art of living on [color/red]
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By the way, is Satan really portrayed by a woman?? What did you hear about this?
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It comes down to the art of living on [color/red]
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Yeah, Satan is played by an androgynous woman (I looked her up on IMDB... here's a link to a picture...
http://www.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0335345/Ss/0335345/1202.jpg?path=pgallery&path_key=Celentano,%20Rosalinda )
I've heard that the film seems anti-women, but of course I haven't seen it and thus can't say anything. You should be able to let us know Jessica.
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Yeah, I'm really interested in seeing this film. I study trauma, violence, the Holocaust and other "happy" topics, so I'm really interested in how graphic this movie is. Not that I am in favor of filmic recreations of such violence, but this is a big question: How much violence is too much for an audience? What is the right balance to convey a particular message? Is there a saturation/
desensitization point? Things like that. So I'm interested to hear your reactions to the movie! Hopefully I'll see it this weekend.
As for the gender issue--that's kind of appropriate that an androgyneous woman plays Satan--sort of avoids the whole question! But apparently this movie does this in a lot of ways (like portraying Pontius Pilate as the opposite of his historically accurate cruel self).
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--Julie
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Wow... those are very cool subject matters. They overlap with what I do, as I study performance of all kinds. In fact this past weekend we were discussing the concept of "catharsis," whether or not the Greek idea that watching violence and horror would purge the audience of such emotions (sorry if you all already know about this) is still relevant, something we should try for in our theatre, or even something useful. Does it motivate us to rectify political wrongs or does it pacify us?
I would love to hear more of what you've found!!!
Two more things: How do you feel about the recent news stories that have come out where Mel Gibson's dad has denied the Holocaust, saying it was largely fictional? And also, I wonder about the portrayal of women's sexuality as an evil thing. I mean, Satan is traditionally a man, so making Satan a woman who refuses to accept her femininity (sort of the opposite of Mary Magdelene, who embraces it too much) is making quite a statement, I think.
Look at me, geeking out.
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I am not trying to pick a fight here, but Mary Magdalene was a prostitute. That is historical fact. And I think that Satan isn't so much supposed to be a woman as a figure. It is the age old question...we really don't know what God and Satan are. Man, Woman, Black, White?? Who knows? But, from what I understand, Mel Gibson does an excellent job with this film and is very close to the way it actually happened. I hope to see it ASAP.
I hope I don't cause any hard feelings....it is just my opinion, as I respect everyone elses here!
Christianne
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it's all about???
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No hard feelings... though I will offer this as a rebuttle to the Magdelene as prostitute fact:
http://whosoeverwill.ca/womenscripturemmagdelene.htm
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I think I will probably see it when it finally comes up here. We normally don't get movies for a few weeks or even months after they've come out. we've got one theather in town with one screen that plays one movie a day for a few days.
I've been really impressed with the discussion that has arisen because of this movie. Although I've heard many people describe it as controversial, all the discussion I've seen about it from all sides of the religious spectrum has been civil and constructive. I think it's great that this movie gets people talking about important things rather than trival things like Janet Jackson's boob!
One thought that I had though, is that although this movie is very much based on the bible, it is still is art. It is written and directed by Mel Gibson and it is his point of view as to what happened. It may be exactly what really happened, but it may not and I think it's very important for people to keep this in mind.
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hI Nuggett; seems to be a really gory,graphic movie. I don't think I could stomachj all that gore but I think it it would be a really powerful movie. I HEARD that one lady had a hard attack after seeing it.mY HAT is off to Mel Gibson for having the guts for making such a controversial movie. He is a very devout christion I think.
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thank you for straithtening these points out. I think somer people should check their fscts first before making statements.
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Jenny,
Your thoughts have intrigued me. I was wondering why they would pick a woman for Satan. I had to ask a few people what they thought. Did I ever mention I am a PK? My dad is a pastor. My brother-in-law is also an associate pastor at the church we go to. I don't go to my parents often.
Anyways, I called my mom and was asking her about the two things you mentioned. First, the woman that plays Satan does seem to have looked masculine with all the makeup. My mom mentioned that Satan is the great deceiver and could appear in many forms. Having said this, doesn't it seem possible that Satan could have been perceived as a woman when he tried tempting Jesus in the desert? Would another man or a woman tempt a man? I would think a woman. I realize that this can seem sexist so to speak but there is some truth to the fact that men are attracted to a woman's appearances.
I ended up calling my brother-in-law about Mary Magdalene. The truth is the bible never says she was a prostitute. It does say she had seven demons cast out. My bil looked it up in a biblical dictionary and it said that scholars think she may have been. One of the reasons is she is from Magdalene and that place was known for prostitution. The other reason is because there was a prostitute mentioned in the chapter before Mary Magdalene was mentioned. Maybe it was a coincidence but it seems that more people than not have thought of her as a prostitute and maybe that is why Mel included it. Does that answer a little bit about that. I guess we will never know for sure but I think it shows Christ compassion and also how he changed lives.
My friends from my bible study are planning on going next week with their husbands. I personally don't think I could handle seeing it, especially being in my first trimester and starting to experience morning sickness. I look forward to finding out what they think. Everything I have heard from people that went was it was excellent. My understanding is that at the end of the movie most of the people can't move until after the credit and most end up crying. I have heard this from many different places. I can only imagine its impact.
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Quote:
I've been really impressed with the discussion that has arisen because of this movie. Although I've heard many people describe it as controversial, all the discussion I've seen about it from all sides of the religious spectrum has been civil and constructive. I think it's great that this movie gets people talking about important things rather than trival things like Janet Jackson's boob!
One thought that I had though, is that although this movie is very much based on the bible, it is still is art. It is written and directed by Mel Gibson and it is his point of view as to what happened. It may be exactly what really happened, but it may not and I think it's very important for people to keep this in mind.
I totally agree!
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Wow, what a great way to put everything. You said exactly what I was thinking...Thank you for being so forward and truthful with everything. And for looking into the facts!
Congrats on your pregnancy by the way!
Christianne
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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it's all about???
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Well, to be fair, it's a subject that people are very invested in and facts to one person are not facts to another.
But, more to the point, after talking to people who did see it, they said Mary Magdelene is hardly discussed (so who knows what the reviewer I read was talking about) so it's not really a debate in this movie. And that it's very, very violent, which as I originally said is what would keep me from seeing the movie.
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hey--sorry I didn't answer your post last night (I didn't have the energy to use my good brain cells for one more minute!). Yes, you are geeking out...but that's ok!
Yeah that's really interesting--does it motivate us to rectify wrongs or pacify us? I don't know, but I think about this a lot. I do think though that art has an amazing capacity to confront us with these issues. At least we've got to take the chance that it might motivate some people, while it pacifies others. I mean how many people will actually read what historians write, but they'll go to movie or play!! Plus, I think art does a better job of conveying emotions and other things that can't be described but felt. But it's a fine balance between moving portrayals and voyeurism (or sadism or Schadenfreude). When do we cross that line? Is mimesis a good thing all the time? What do you think??
I do very much think that accuracy is as important as intent in any representation though(ok, maybe historians are picky, but why spread lies). Oh, yes, that get me to your point about Holocaust denial (speaking of liars!). That his father said this is pretty irrelvant to me...Mel'snot his father. If Mel were to deny the Holocaust himself, I would not see the movie and would totally boycott anything he was remotely associated with. Otherwise, Holocaust deniers pretty much only convince themselves and look incredibly stupid when they actually have to explicate their arguments (duh! huge gaps, obvious misunderstandings, etc--and the kicker--how do explain away all the physical evidence of mass death). Ok I won't rant on about these losers any more...
Your question about female sexuality is sooo interesting...I'm going to watch out for that when I see the film! What's your opinion?
ok, this is long enough....
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--Julie
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All I have to say is WOW. I've never seen such an impactful movie ever in my life. Everyone was crying, praying, and otherwise silent.
I wouldn't say that Satan was portrayed as a woman....it was definitley an androgynous character. I think it's just that it was played by a woman. I honestly think that the character wasn't necessary, and it almost ruined the movie for me. I don't think Satan should have had an actual person for its portrayal, but rather a symbol or an idea, you know? Mary Magdelene is a big part in the Bible, also. Society generally degrades prostitutes as less worthy, but Christ accepted Mary openly when she came to him for help to turn her life around.
The gore wasn't as bad as I thought, but mostly because I was prepared for it. But there is a lot of blood, I'll tell you that.
Jenny, I really think that you should see this movie since you're the big producer around her. Maybe you should see it and share some fo your thoughts.
Actually, I think that EVERYONE should see it. It's very moving and it makes you think. OHHHHHHHH I meant to say that I don't think the movie shows Jews as the killer of Christ. In fact, they pull a Jew out of the crowd and he helps Jesus carry his cross. He ends up saving Jesus from a probable death from their beatings.
Anyway, go see this movie, then think about it for a while. If you have anymore questions, just ask!
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It comes down to the art of living on [color/red]
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Quote:
I've heard that the film seems anti-women, but of course I haven't seen it and thus can't say anything.
I htink that it only comes off that way because in those days, people pretty much were anti-woman, you know? But they do have awoman help Jesus as he's stumbling and falling from his injuries. And his mother's character was my favorite! She was excellent and showed all of a mother's true feelings!
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It comes down to the art of living on [color/red]
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Im hoping to go see it today with my husband, his cousin, her husband and our son and his girlfriend (hubby is going to stand in line for tickets)....I think its going to be great and will help people come to CHRIST...I know it graphic but I want to see it...I will let you know how it is.
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Gretchen
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I saw the movie the Monday prior to it coming out. I live in TN and almost all the churches seemed to get prepurchased tickets reserved for an entire theater and the tickets sold very fast.
The movie is very graphic and powerful. But I support Mel Gibson in this production. The movie is ment to portray just what Jesus Christ went through for all of us. For me it really put into perspective what he actually had to indure. Reading books and knowing the story is so much different then actually seeing it with your own eyes.
It makes we as Christians, and non-believers alike, realize just how much more we can do. I think the questions and criticizm is just what we need in todays world. This movie is a great tool for helping others see what Jesus was all about and being witnesses of His unfathonable love for us.
Those are just my personal thoughts. The movie was tough to watch at times - but that is what made it so powerful. And the Devil was played by a women. I believe Mel's response to that was that he didn't want the devil to appear too scary, but at the same time, show its evilness and betrayel with its actions and carisma.
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"Love isn't love, until you give it away!"
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I just got home from seeing the movie and Im mentally worn out...I cried and cried...for it showed how my Lord gave his life to save us from our sin...what an unconditional love he has for us....he bared soooo much pain and agony...I just wanted to help him...It has definately affected my life
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Gretchen
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I just went and saw this tonight! WOW, that was amazing! I feel it was worth watching. It's really humbeling. I think everyone should see this.
Gosh I don't know what to say....it was very emotional for me. It made me sad, mad,scared, happy....sick....etc! Every emotion you could have.
I thought it was put together well. OH....its really hard to describe. Anyway...if you haven't seen it and are debating if you should or shouldn't....I recommend that you do! Makes you want to change your life and become a better person!
WOW!!!!!
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I have seen this movie twice and I really liked it. It really makes an impact that lasts. The violence is rough, but I was ready for it; so it wasn't as bad as I'd imagined it was going to be.
I really would have preferred Mary Magdalene to be portrayed accurately, but there are lots of scenes in the movie that aren't in the Bible. However, it IS a movie and Mel Gibson certainly expressed his creative side. Overall, though, I really think it's a great movie. I plan on buying it and watching it at least once a year!
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Hi Teri!
#62301 - 04/18/04 09:33 AM
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StephS
Reged: 09/11/03
Posts: 2123
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Quote:
I really would have preferred Mary Magdalene to be portrayed accurately
Just curious...how do you think she should have been portrayed???
I think I'll buy this too. Its a very powerful show.
Thanks!
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I saw it and I didn't like it. It seemed like lots of pointless blood and gory-ness. I mean really, did they need to show him getting so ripped apart?? It just sickened me and it just seemed like the whole point of the movie was to show as much blood spurting out of him as possible. I just thought it was dumb.
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IBS-C
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Hi StephS,
Chinagrl is right about Mary Magdalene NOT being a prostitute and it was obvious that she was portrayed as one in the movie. The Bible doesn't give us the name of the woman whose stoning was prevented by Jesus, but a lot people think it was Mary Magdelene. But,I realize that Mel Gibson is an artist and he used his creative license in the making of this movie. It was still an excellent show though and I'm glad I saw it!
Terri
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