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Re: Hi Phil new
      #175058 - 04/29/05 09:47 AM
Phil-AZ

Reged: 04/16/05
Posts: 29
Loc: Sunny AZ

Hi Stephie, thanks for the welcome, and thoughts.
I suppose I just bristled a bit when Linz basically said that I shouldn't post what works for me, just because it doesn't work for her. Especially, since I have been through EXACTLY what Justin is going through, so I really know where he is coming from, and what he is trying to do with his diet. I wasn't posting for others, when I was giving my suggestions to Justin.

I also feel that much of the guidelines are based on personal experience. If I were to try to follow the IBS guidelines on this site, without modifying them for myself, I would be very ill. I think there are many others who post here that also have special needs that don't entirely fit the guidelines, judging by much of the despair I see posted here, along with all of the posts about medications. I mean no offense to Heather in saying that. I really admire what she is doing for people, and this site is a fantastic resource. I just think people need to be able to think outside the box to find what works for them, rather than just blindly following somebody elses guidelines.

A few personal examples:
Disclaimer: This is what I experience, and may not be right for you. If you have any hesitation, please follow the guidelines on this site.

Lettuce: I can eat TONS of lettuce, with no issues whatsoever. Lettuce IS NOT a salad. There are many items that go into a salad that can trigger IBS. For me Lettuce is not one of them.

Fruit: This to me is a major trigger of IBS. It is due to a frequently undiagnosed Fructose Malabsorption problem, of which I have posted links above to back up this view. I find that fruit will give my D every time. I know many other IBS'rs that have the same issue. According to the guidelines on this site, fruit is fine.

Olive Oil: Another recomended item on this site, that will immediately give me an attack of IBS. Even very small amounts of this will do it. I have no problem with Rice oil.

Potatoes: This is a huge IBS trigger for me, and will give my IBS every time. I suspect it is a Nightshade allergy, and is probably a personal issue that will not apply to to many people.

Quinoa: This has been suggested in a post just above. Personally, I find the Saponins (soap like compounds) that are contained in Quinoa, very irritating to my intestines. (If you decide to try this grain, I advise washing it very thoroughly before cooking it).

As you can see, if I decided to follow the guidelines blindly, and not experiment to find what works for me, I would certainly be on medication. As it is, I am totally stable (as long as I don't eat the offending foods) and I take ABSOLUTELY NO MEDICATION. I feel this last point is crucial, because IMO there is no medication that does not have long term negative effects. I take the personal view that food is not entertainment. I eat only what is necessary for my health. I do not hold the view that I am deprived and need to take medicine so that I can have a party in my mouth

Anyway, I appreciate the thoughts, and hope that I can continue to contribute my experiences on this site, without being censored. Of course, if Heather wishes me to not post any of my experiences that are contrary to the guidelines, I will respect her wishes.



--------------------
Phil

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Re: Hi Phil new
      #175070 - 04/29/05 10:20 AM
Stephie

Reged: 03/10/04
Posts: 2696
Loc: Vancouver, Canada

Quote:

Hi Stephie, thanks for the welcome, and thoughts.
I suppose I just bristled a bit when Linz basically said that I shouldn't post what works for me, just because it doesn't work for her. Especially, since I have been through EXACTLY what Justin is going through, so I really know where he is coming from, and what he is trying to do with his diet. I wasn't posting for others, when I was giving my suggestions to Justin.

And I think that is absolutely fine. It's not like we are selling anything, we just want to help people feel better. And if the things you suggest work for him, I say power to you.

Fruit: This to me is a major trigger of IBS. It is due to a frequently undiagnosed Fructose Malabsorption problem, of which I have posted links above to back up this view. I find that fruit will give my D every time. I know many other IBS'rs that have the same issue. According to the guidelines on this site, fruit is fine.

Well, not all fruit is safe. And most often, it is something to be eaten after something else is already in your belly. But I too have problems with fruit. Like, even if I peeled it, if I ate an apple I'd be in loads of pain. This is where I think the food diary recommended by loads of people comes in handy. That way, you set your own guidelines according to what you can see written down. "I ate this, and got sick. I ate it again, got sick again. I won't eat this anymore". So for me, apples are out.
Just out of curiosity, is it all fruit that you can't digest? Can you have things like applesauce or anything like that? I am just curious.


Olive Oil: Another recomended item on this site, that will immediately give me an attack of IBS. Even very small amounts of this will do it. I have no problem with Rice oil.
Olive oil is not recommended for people trying to get stable, no oils are. It is the better of a few evils for a lot of people, though. I can handle it fine, but while I was getting stable I avoided it completely.
Potatoes: This is a huge IBS trigger for me, and will give my IBS every time. I suspect it is a Nightshade allergy, and is probably a personal issue that will not apply to to many people.
NO POTATOES? HOW do you live??

As you can see, if I decided to follow the guidelines blindly, and not experiment to find what works for me, I would certainly be on medication.
Maybe this is where you and I will disagree the most - I feel that handling IBS is down to the individual. These guidelines, not just about food but about alternative therapies, yoga, soothing teas, medication, tips on eating out, etc, are only that - A rough guide. It took me over a year to understand not what "IBS" meant, but what "my IBS" meant. That means diaries of all your food, all your medication, all the stresses going on in your life,all your symptoms. That means learning stress management techniques and relaxation that work for ME. So, if you did the same as me, you could follow a lot of the advice whilst still being able to recognise that you, for example, cannot tolerate potatoes and that you can tolerate some vegetables others can't. As it is, I am totally stable (as long as I don't eat the offending foods) and I take ABSOLUTELY NO MEDICATION. I feel this last point is crucial, because IMO there is no medication that does not have long term negative effects. I take the personal view that food is not entertainment. I eat only what is necessary for my health. I do not hold the view that I am deprived and need to take medicine so that I can have a party in my mouth
Party in your mouth, LOL, that's funny. I can't remember the last time I had a "party" in my mouth. For me, medication is important. I cut out everything except rice and water and was still sick, so I needed the medication to get stable. I have had no ill effects from it as yet. Like you, I am not a medication fan. If I could go without, I would. But I was unemployed and broke and needed to be able to leave the house, so there we go!

Anyway, I appreciate the thoughts, and hope that I can continue to contribute my experiences on this site, without being censored. Of course, if Heather wishes me to not post any of my experiences that are contrary to the guidelines, I will respect her wishes.
Oh psh, I don't think anyone wants to sensor you or have you kicked off the boards just for telling someone to try eating lettuce! For the love of Pete, it's not like you're telling him to eat McDonalds every day and see how he does. I think you might have the wrong idea here, we are here to support and help people.. not force something onto unsuspecting people who are suffering.
Anywho, I'm at work now so I best look busy and.. type something.. or something.
Nice to talk to you... I like you, you're chatty!
--Steph






--------------------
~~I'm not crazy, I'm just a little unwell-I know right now you can't tell~~Matchbox 20
IBS-D,pain.

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Re: Hi Phil new
      #175084 - 04/29/05 11:03 AM
Phil-AZ

Reged: 04/16/05
Posts: 29
Loc: Sunny AZ

Nice to talk to you too Stephie. If every one is as nice as you, I think I am going to enjoy it here.

It is the Fruit sugar, that is my problem. Lack of Fructose digesting enzymes, or something like that. Peeled, Cooked, Mashed, Sauce, it doesn't matter. I hope to some day be able to add it back, as I heal my gut.

Potatoes were a love of mine for many years, but for now it is Rice for me

--------------------
Phil

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Re: Hi Phil new
      #175129 - 04/29/05 01:36 PM
Ghost

Reged: 04/24/05
Posts: 20


Dear Phil,

Hello again. Let me say first--you are the MAN!

Seriously, I wanted to let you know, if you do not already know, that you can be even ricier than you are now because there are rice protein supplements out on the market. One of the two I have seen, by Nutrabiotic, is vegan and is non-gmo. Unfortunately, it is not organic. it has 12g protein per serving, and they do not use anything besides water and natural enzymes to process the rice. For me, it looks like a good match.

Two more notes. Your fruit suggestions were helpful; I am mainly trying to combine them with bland things, such as rice or plain oatmeal or even nuts in small amounts (1/2 oz. or less).

Also, I am utterly convinced now that soy is a major problem for me. I had a D attack this morning after having 4 servings of soy yesterday--2 c soymilk, some soy yogurt, and tofu. God, what a nightmare. I wonder if anyone else with IBS has soy problems, since soy is listed as safe on Heather's site.

Be well.
-Justin

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Soy new
      #175131 - 04/29/05 01:43 PM
Stephie

Reged: 03/10/04
Posts: 2696
Loc: Vancouver, Canada

Hi,
I know I'm not Phil, but I just wanted to stick my head in about the soy thing.
Have you ever eaten soy before? I mean, was it already in your diet?
If you do a search for 'soy' or 'soy intolerance' on the Diet board, you'll find tons of info. You'll see that soy is safe for most people BUT it is something that your body takes time to adjust to. You may not be intolerant to soy (you might be), it might just be that you added it in too quickly. Like, if you weren't eating any soy and then suddenly had 4 servings that is A LOT for your body to try and cope with.

Try adding soy really gradually into your diet and see if you still get problems. Definitely don't have more than one serving a day at first.

HTH,
Steph

--------------------
~~I'm not crazy, I'm just a little unwell-I know right now you can't tell~~Matchbox 20
IBS-D,pain.

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Hmmm new
      #175149 - 04/29/05 02:46 PM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

Didn't need to cause so much aggro, but as everyone's IBS is different, what worked for Phil is not neccessarily going to work for Justin. Unfortunately, Justin's post didn't get much response at first so he was only getting Phil's advice (hi btw! ) which just meant that he was getting a one-sided view.

Also...important note...food intolerances are actually separate to IBS even though they impact on it. Heather's diet will work for pretty much every IBSer WHO HAS NOTHING ELSE GOING ON. Working out if other problems are there is a major part of the first stage of having IBS.

You can post anything, but it's just alot better all round if you say..."this is what worked for me"... until you know that it's something that works for many people.

Hope that's okay!

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Re: Soy new
      #175252 - 04/30/05 04:37 AM
Ghost

Reged: 04/24/05
Posts: 20


Dear Steph,

Sorry if I was not clear on the soy thing. I did not introduce soy recently but have been using it for a long time now--ever since I became vegan 6 years ago, though more in the past year or so than before that because my protein was dreadfully low. Soy has been something on my "watch out" radar for quite a while now, and the more experiences I have with it lead me to believe that it is definitely a trigger food for me, at least in most forms I have tried so far.

I can see why it would be safe for many people, as Heather describes it elsewhere, but for me it just does not seem to work even when combined with other SF things like rice. Plus, the estrogen issues for men using soy are another thing to consider. Anyway, thank you for your reply!

Be well.
-Justin

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