re: mrae - Shawneric + functional d vs. IBS
#354458 - 01/12/10 04:36 PM
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PMartin
Reged: 08/05/08
Posts: 140
Loc: Niagara Region
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Mrae and I have previously acknowledged the similarity in our symptoms being that while we battle urgency and frequency with loose stools, we don't experience pain or what I always thought were typical IBS symptoms (although Syl has informed me otherwise) like prompt reactions to "trigger" foods. Naturally, I am interested in Shawneric's suggestion that this may indicate Functional D rather than IBS. How much does this change what I've been doing; the EFI diet, medications, supplements?
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IBS-D. Or so a doctor says.
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One of the criteria for IBS is "Recurrent abdominal pain or discomfort" where discomfort means an uncomfortable sensation not described as pain. In contrast the criteria for Functional D is "loose (mushy) or watery stools without pain occurring in at least 75% of stools".
If you don't have pain do you have discomfort?
Here is a link to a good brochure on functional from IFFGD. There is a section on treatment that suggests it is similar to the EFI diet with a few more restrictions particularly some complex carbohydrates. Not sure about supplements. This brochure says functional D is thought to be a subset of IBS.
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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I certainly don't experience pain and as for discomfort, it's more like an uneasy, nervous feeling, between BM's of which are loose and watery like you say, upon the first 2 to 3 hours of waking up. This feeling is usually an indication of not being done and another BM to come. Then like a switch being turned off, I'm fine for the rest of the day. This has been everyday for at least the past 10 years.
With the supplements I am taking, I've got the frequency down to 2 with much bulkier and formed stools but there is still more urgency than I can feel comfortable about. Thanks for the link and the mention of complex carbohydrates. I'll have to look into it but a large part of my diet is oatmeal and plain white rice.
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IBS-D. Or so a doctor says.
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Pain or dicomfort is a must for an ibs diagnoses.
Diet wise, I would personally say not to much really.
I don't know what meds or supplements your on?
You might want to look at this and scroll down to functional d.
http://www.romecriteria.org/pdfs/p1480FBDs.pdf
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My website on IBS is www.ibshealth.com
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PMartin, what supplements are you taking? I am on lomotil. It helps sooo much but when I have an anxiety attack nothing really helps to much. I am very interested in this functional D also. Let me know what you find out and I will be researching it also.
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Mrae, have you tried Mike's tapes?
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My website on IBS is www.ibshealth.com
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What dosage of Lomotil are you taking?
I get frustrated as it seems the harder I try to figure things out, the harder and more confusing it gets.
It looks like by definition, I(we) don't have IBS as there is no pain, just diarrhea. However, there doesn't appear to be any difference in how one would approach treating it, primarily with diet including, as Syl pointed out, additional concern with complex carbohydrates. So it turns out that there is something called Complex Carbohydrate Intolerance (CCI) www.preventcci.com/ If you check the food list, you will notice that a lot of these foods are on the "trigger" list for EFI. If you are already avoiding them, this may lead you to question if it's worth considering and possibly dismiss it altogether. Myself however, can't overlook the fact that although I already do my best to avoid additional foods (despite being deemed safe on the EFI diet) like breads and pasta, oatmeal and rice are an everyday staple for me. When I sat back and took the time to really think about it, I realized there has probably never been a time in my life since developing IBS that I wasn't eating some form of complex carbohydrate.
It seems as though the only way to treat this (aside from avoiding to eat any Complex Carbohydrates) at present, meaning to put the enzyme alpha-galactosidase which can break down complex carbohydrates into simple sugars that the body can more easily absorb into our body, is with Beano (who is actually behind the site that I gave the link for so take what you want from that).
As for your question, I use..
*Psyllium (to bulk my stool)
*Calcium (supposedly has a constipating effect)
*Probiotics (for good gut flora)
*L-glutamine and taurine (essential amino acids)
*and just recently started with Melatonin as per postings with Syl and Shawneric.
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IBS-D. Or so a doctor says.
Edited by PMartin (01/15/10 09:24 PM)
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Yes I have tried the tapes. Didn't really do to much for me.
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Did you make it all the way through them?
Did they have any effect?
By any chance do you take antacids?
are you on any meds?
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My website on IBS is www.ibshealth.com
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Caltrate in the purple box helped me immensely with urgency and frequency. I take two a day, morning and bedtime. If you haven't tried this, I highly recommend it. I've been taking since Oct and it's changed my IBS for the better.
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Kathe, I did this too and it really helped. My IBS seems to cycle, and when I was in a period of D, the mornings were a nightmare. I started taking a Caltrate at bedtime, and it was great. Now D is not my problem, so I stopped.
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I've been thinking about relistening to them to see if maybe one more time through will help. I don't take antacids. I do take lomotil everyday and Librium when needed for anxiety. Sometimes I feel if I could get my anxiety under control my ibs wouldn't be as bad most of the time. I never had this much anxiety until I started having ibs and it only seems to be getting worse. I got locked out of my house and instantly had a major anxiety attack and went into the fight or flight mode. I mean really something so small sent me in a spiral spin. I just dont' understand it.
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I've tried the calcium hoping it would be of help but not much of one for me. I am glad to hear it works for you. It seems to help alot of people.
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mrae, I think another listen might help you with the anxiety. Two rounds have helped me tremendously. Had that been me, it probably would not have even phased me, just some mild irritation, not panic about a bathroom, and that is because of Mike's tapes. Try them again and see if it makes a difference.
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Give it another go mrae, its certainly safe and the second time around might really help.
I am glad you understand the impact of the fight or flight on all this, cause that is really important as you have noticed.
I am waiting for a responce from someone hopefully on the villi question.
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My website on IBS is www.ibshealth.com
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The caltrate removes water from your colon, therefore, allowing for more solid BMs. I haven't had an IBS attack since I got regular with the Caltrate. I do have a bit of C now, but it's not enough to worry about, and a little C is much better than alot of D and not being able to control the D in public places. I hope it helps others, I've had the urgency issues since 04 and I highly recommend all IBS-D with urgency problems give it a try. Some people take 3 a day, I found I only need two.
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i'm just curious about the caltrate in the purple box...doesn't it have magnesieum in it? isn't that bad for ibs-d? my dr said to take just plain caltrate without the magnesieum..i was taking it with your suggestion but got nervous when the dr told me about the magnesium....
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Not sure about the magnesium. It's been working wonders for me. I started in Oct and the urgency has been controlled. I got my info from this site:
http://www.ibsgroup.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=72764
I say try it, give it a few weeks, if no work, then stop, but if it works, then's it wonderful.
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