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Sand - enabling post
      #328747 - 04/23/08 04:17 PM
Wendy2

Reged: 01/24/05
Posts: 6


I had a nice message sent out and I guess it was lost in translation when your post got put on the main message board page. I agree that some posts have been negative. I admit that I am one does not follow the diet 100 percent. I am trying to figure out my trigger foods and I've got it narrowed down well now.

I do think though that the posts about people saying what they can eat(even though it may be a trigger food)is helpful. I found out from another person they have the same tolerance/intolerance as me: we can eat pizza, but not ice cream. Which until I read that thought this was all "in my head." I could not figure out how it's possible to be able to eat pizza, but not ice cream considering dairy is in both.

Needless to say I felt a BIG relief when I read that. I thought, wow, I'm not the only one. I am, however, the only one in my "real" life I know that has IBS. It is very difficult to adapt to the diet while others around me can eat so freely. I think some posters get frustrated by that. But, the diet is very helpful and I think it has made a big difference in my life.

This site is a gift to me from Heather and everyone else. I was truly miserable before this site. If someone's post helps one person, it's worth it. I basically disregard the posts that I can't relate to or that are really off base. I have found many people who are inspirational and I appreciate their suggestions greatly. Here's to a happy tummy!

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FANTASTIC POST Sand!! new
      #328758 - 04/23/08 06:20 PM
Toady

Reged: 04/06/06
Posts: 1299
Loc: A small city, Northwestern Ontario, Canada

Sand, as always you are a wonder!!

It's fantastic that you write out what a lot of us think.

There are days that I get so frustrated with the diet board that I refuse to check it for weeks on end. A HAM sandwich - STEAK - BEEF TACOS - OMG!!! Just the thought of those send my tummy turning. I cannot tolerate it, so I don't bother testing my system to see if I can. It's just something you learn after 16 - 17 years of IBS. It's NOT WORTH THE PAIN!!! My grandma even gave up trying to get me to eat stuff years ago, she could see my misery without cheating on the diet, she didn't want to subject me to worse.

Someone posted to ask me why I didn't eat meat from Taco Bell restaurants. BECAUSE a) IT'S BEEF!!! b) It's loaded with fat and things I can't tolerate and c) IT'S BEEF! I didn't even reply to the poster, sorry, but if you have to ask you haven't been paying attention to the diet. I'll eat a VEGGIE wrap or VEGGIE burrito. No cheese, sour cream or spicy salsa stuff. Thought that pretty much covered what I found safe at a Mexican fast food outlet.

I do heartly believe that the people that do not find success with the diet are not commited to the diet 100%. Yep, I'll admit, I cheat. But I don't come with my sob story to the board and list the foods we shouldn't be eating that I just wolfed down after eating my willpower with it. I'll confess, popcorn is my weakpoint. Heather's directive is correct - no nutritional value, no point in eating it, but it's the one thing I gave up for two years and did re-incorporate into my diet just the last 6 months or so.

And while I'm here - why is it that the same topic is covered over and over and over? Coffee! Good grief! CAFFEINE = BAD, get it, got it, good! Still not sure, search the 1001 other posts about coffee or decaf or half fat, double shot, decaf, no foam drinks! PLEASE!!! Search or read old posts before you start the topic that has been beaten to death.

Luv ya Sand - thanks for speaking up for us that love Heather and the board!!

--------------------
Cassandra

Live like there's no tomorrow. Love like you've never loved before.

IBS A 20+ years, Chronic Migraines, Chiari Malformation (decompressed June 22, 2010), Brachial Neuritis, and ??? the list just keeps growing, but I'm still shiny side up!

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Re: FANTASTIC POST Sand!! new
      #328760 - 04/23/08 06:48 PM
lalala

Reged: 02/14/05
Posts: 2634


Sand, you're the best! This is exactly how I've been feeling the past couple of months and why I haven't been offering advice or posting as often. I get the feeling that some people don't want advice that relates to Heather's EFI plan (which is what these boards are for) and are doing exactly what you said: enabling each other. Thank you for saying this!

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Re: FANTASTIC POST Sand!! new
      #328778 - 04/24/08 09:14 AM
tovabela

Reged: 11/07/07
Posts: 40
Loc: NYC

Thank you for so eloquently sharing what many of us wanted to say but just couldn't put into words.

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Re: FANTASTIC POST Sand!! new
      #328782 - 04/24/08 10:07 AM
CarolynC

Reged: 03/11/08
Posts: 108
Loc: Connecticut

I just wanted to comment that, being a newbie here, I have been getting confused by many of the posts. I've been reading Heather's books cover to cover and came to the message boards for support. The post from Sand clears a whole lot up for someone just starting the EFI diet.
Thanks!

--------------------
IBS-C with bloating and cramps
occasional type A


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Re: Sand - enabling post new
      #328791 - 04/24/08 11:52 AM
Lisa Marie

Reged: 07/17/06
Posts: 1566
Loc: Lakewood, CO

You hit the nail on the head, Sand. This is exactly why I have been absent for quite some time. I got tired of people posting the crap they are eating every day, and wondering why they, in turn, feel like crap. For you newbies out there, you may think there are a whole lot of lists and rules... but I guarantee you that if you stick with it, it will become second nature and you won't even think about it. I know that's how it worked for me. Sure, people give me funny looks when I say I'm vegan, but don't eat salads. But that says a hell of a lot about what it can truly mean to be vegan; there's so much good, normal food out there!

Thanks again, Sand!!

--------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Lisa, IBS-C (Vegan)
Stable since July 2007!
Mommy to Rhiannon Marie (Dec. 13, 2008)

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Re: Sand - enabling post new
      #328798 - 04/24/08 01:48 PM
emmasmom

Reged: 09/22/06
Posts: 1710
Loc: ILL

Good post you are so right about all of this. The people who reallly want help and really want to do this like me, this post will help. Thanks for the post form the people who really want the help! xxx and thanks again for helping me when I ask!
emmasmom
ibs-c
gas


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Re: Sand - enabling post new
      #328805 - 04/24/08 03:03 PM
Snorkie

Reged: 02/15/05
Posts: 1999
Loc: Northern Illinois, USA

I know I'm one of the people who says I eat X, Y, or Z trigger and tolerate it. However, I also try to point out that I am stable or have learned awhile ago I am able to tolerate a trigger. I also at least sometimes say that IBS is a very individual thing and what works for me may not work for someone else. I know my system.

However, I will NOT ever again touch beef with a 10-foot pole. No way, UH UH!

We are all at least a little different. Be careful with the triggers. Especially if you are not stable, expect "retribution" if you indulge.

Don't know if I'm trying to defend myself or what, but I just wanted to put that out there.


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Sand - it is a very good post - nt - new
      #328806 - 04/24/08 03:16 PM
Double J

Reged: 03/09/06
Posts: 900
Loc: High Rocky Mountains ibs-d



--------------------
Courage doesn’t always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, “I will try again tomorrow”. Mary Anne Radmacher

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Re: Sand - enabling post new
      #328817 - 04/25/08 05:48 AM
tc2004

Reged: 05/26/04
Posts: 118
Loc: Texas

Sand,

Again a wonderful post
So true
Thanks
Terry

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For Wendy2 new
      #328846 - 04/25/08 10:03 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

I'm glad this Heather's approach has been so helpful for you. It was certainly a life-saver for me.

I have to say I don't understand why someone else talking about being able to eat a trigger food would be helpful. I figure once you're stable, if you're lucky enough to be able to eat pizza you shouldn't question your luck - just be grateful.

Having said that, however, if you have a question that you need to ask and you have to admit you eat pizza in order to ask your question, then please at least give a nod to the fact that this is supposed to be a support Board for the EFI Diet. Say, "I know dairy is a trigger food and not allowed on the EFI Diet. However, now that I'm stable I find I'm lucky enough to be able to eat pizza without suffering. I still can't eat ice cream however. Any ideas why this might be?" That tells newbies that eating pizza is *not* SOP around here. It also tells people like me that you understand the Diet principles and you're stable so I won't post something like, "Pizza?! Are you crazy?!" (Note to everyone who is not stable: There is no way to say with a straight face, "I'm not stable but pizza doesn't bother me.")

Again, there's a big difference between saying you eat a trigger food in order to ask a question and saying you eat a trigger food in order to reassure someone who's trying to get stable that she can just ignore those pesky little food lists - it's fine for her to eat whatever her little heart desires.

As for disregarding "the posts that ... are really off base", I see two problems with that. First, while it works for you because you understand the Diet well enough to get stable, it can be awfully hard for a new poster to figure out which posts are really off base. Second, if everyone disregards posts that are really off base the person who is posting is not getting any help figuring out what to do to feel better.

BTW, I see that you haven't posted in over three years. Welcome back.

BTW - again - I couldn't find the post from the other person who could eat pizza but not ice cream. Could you point me to it? Thanks.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

Edited by Sand (04/25/08 10:05 AM)

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Snorkie new
      #328848 - 04/25/08 10:18 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

As I said in my post to Wendy2, I can understand that there may occasionally be good reasons to mention being able to eat a trigger food. As long as the statement makes clear that this is not EFI approved and is only possible because the lucky poster is stable and can handle it, I don't see a problem with that.

What I object to is people who mention trigger foods only to encourage others to not worry too much about what they eat. And the constant repetition of these statements. Over and over and over. Sheesh. (Sorry. Mini-rant.) Ahem.

I'm not sure if you're trying to defend yourself, either, but for what's it worth you certainly don't stick in my mind as someone who takes the "don't pay too much attention to Heather's guidelines" approach to the Boards.

Take care.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: Snorkie new
      #328849 - 04/25/08 10:29 AM
Snorkie

Reged: 02/15/05
Posts: 1999
Loc: Northern Illinois, USA

Okay. Thanks for responding. I know there are a number of triggers I don't have too much trouble with. I tend to mention them only if a question comes up on the boards. I'm certainly not going to encourage people to go out and try them just because it's okay for me.

I understand about the things that get asked and answered over and over again. If I respond to those at all, it's brief.

I'm sure we all made mistakes when just starting the EFI diet, but I too just cringe when I read what some of the new folks are eating because I remember how I felt three years ago. It was miserable.



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Re: For Wendy2 For Sand and Heather new
      #328850 - 04/25/08 10:36 AM
Wendy1234

Reged: 02/06/08
Posts: 98


Sand, I do not know what to think of your post to me. I am not going to rat out the person who said they can eat pizza, but not ice cream. I have been posting for quite a while, but when I wrote that post I used a different computer that had a different handle (I didn't realize this until later).

I am sorry if what I've been saying has been confusing to some people. And quite frankly I don't want to post anymore. This is probably why people have been leaving the boards and you are left with negative people. It's not fair to be scrutinized over what I eat when I ask questions like everybody else.

Just because I can eat pizza (I don't get pepperoni, only black olives in case there was a question about that) does not mean I don't have ibs problems like everybody else on the board. I still have diarreah, constipation, stress, days of eating the "safe" foods send me to the bathroom, anxiety, just like you and everyone else.

This is pretty upsetting to me because I love this board. I ask legitimate questions that are important to me. I hope other people can learn, but I think we all know, even newbies, that our bodies are all different.

BTW, I have bought Heather's books, dvd, peppermint tea and acacia fiber. So the fact that I'm buying all of her items she is selling on the site does prove I have ibs, just in case you were wondering about that too. It's a shame I have to defend myself on what I can/cannot eat. I do follow the diet most of the time and I'm learning what I can eat. I think Heather's diet has been a big help.

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Toady new
      #328851 - 04/25/08 10:38 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Thanks, Cassandra.

It is overwhelming sometimes, isn't it? The thought of even trying to help people sort things out with all the misinformation floating out there just makes me want to go lie down with a cold compress on my head.

I had to laugh at your rant about coffee. Mine is, "But can I eat cheese?" Seriously, though, I can live with newbies asking about coffee (or cheese) - I was totally clueless about how to do a Search when I first started on the Boards plus I had no idea how many topics were already covered. It does really bother me, though, when someone who's been on the Board for years brings it up. It's not like the information is going to have changed.

Popcorn. Oh, yeah, I love popcorn. And I feel so lucky I can eat it even though it's such a tough IF.

Again, thanks for responding. I really appreciate it.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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For Wendy1234 new
      #328852 - 04/25/08 12:10 PM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

I wasn't asking you to "rat out" the person who said they could eat pizza but not ice cream. I was just curious because I remembered someone saying they could eat a little dairy but never ice cream and they figured out it was because the ice cream was cold. I wondered if the person you referred to felt cold was the problem, also. (What did you think I was going to with the information once you provided it, anyhow?)

As for the rest of your post, I have no idea what you're talking about and frankly I feel like I've landed in some alternate universe. I did not in any way single you out as someone who has been confusing people. As far as I knew the post I responded to was only your 3rd post ever and the first two were about peppermint capsules and organic food. I certainly did not suggest that you should not ask questions nor did I in any way, shape, or form imply that you didn't have IBS nor did I ask you to defend what you eat. All I said was that if you're going to post that you eat a trigger food, please make sure you clearly state that that food is not safe under Heather's guidelines. (I did assume you were stable - what with the pizza and all - and I suspect that is mostly why you're mad at me.)

I don't know what you mean about it not being fair for you to be scrutinized over what you eat when you ask questions. The point of the Diet Board is to help people figure out how to eat in accordance with the EFI Guidelines. If you post you're suffering from your IBS symptoms and say that you eat pizza with cheese, I'm going to try to help by pointing out that cheese is a trigger food and probably what's keeping you from feeling better. That's what the Boards are for.

That said, if you would prefer I personally never offer you advice when you post, that's fine - just say so. If you do not want any advice based on the EFI Guidelines when you post, then I suggest you say so in your signature line so everyone knows not to offer it.

And BTW -
Quote:

This is probably why people have been leaving the boards...


Care to explain this? Not the part where it's all my fault - I understand that - just a little backup to your claim that people anyone has, in fact, left the Boards because they're over-scrutinized.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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To everyone else... new
      #328853 - 04/25/08 12:14 PM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Thanks to all of you for responding so positively. I really appreciate the feedback. And it's nice to know I'm not totally on the fringe here.

Take care.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: For Wendy1234 new
      #328854 - 04/25/08 12:28 PM
Wendy1234

Reged: 02/06/08
Posts: 98


You are right Sand. You did not single me out exactly. But it seems whenever someone goes with something other than the diet, there is backlash. And not from you per se. I will be more careful, but honestly I probably won't post anymore. I do not want to deter newbies at all and they are the ones who need the most help. I am confused on what is acceptable questions/topics and what's not. Reading other posts people talk about things other than EFI diet. To the new people, sorry about confusing posts. The diet does work and it does take time. It's taken me more than three years and I'm still learning. Just hang in there.

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Informative / corrections / different perspective new
      #328908 - 04/26/08 11:23 AM
Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5499
Loc: SK, CANADA

Sand - I just returned from a wonderful driving holiday to the West coast. I read your informative and well written enabling posting. It is apparent that you are frustrated with postings of new comers that don't know the EFI diet. I empathize with this frustration.

Before making any observations I would like to correct the comments you made specifically about me.

I am a he not a she. It strange how some people on this board make assumptions without checking the facts.

Syl would not have said there is no evidence that dairy is a problem. He would have said there is limited evidence that proteins or other ingredients in dairy other than lactose is a problem for IBS suffers (e.g. see this message).

Syl would never have felt that the best way to do that is to clear up the pesky little unscientific problems with Heather's otherwise helpful approach. In fact, he feels that EFI diet is a wonderful place to begin to learn to manage IBS symptoms because generally speaking it follows the research finding. I always point IBS suffers that I meet on my travels to the EFI diet. However, IBS research has progressed and some new understandings have emerged. For example, limiting the consumption of IF is as beneficial for IBS-C as IBS-D. And IBS suffers have more problems with some short chained carbohydrates such as fructose and sugar alcohols that was originally thought to be the case. The later is evident from the number of IBS new comers to this board over the past year that have reported positive fructose malabsorption tests.

It is wonderful that there is a research library on this web site. Unfortunately, many members of the board don't have the training or knowledge to understand much of the material. It is important to interpret the library postings and other research findings even if they contradict the EFI guidelines so that each person can make up their own mind if they wish to use or ignore the new information.

Unfortunately, at least for me, if I had adopted the it works if you work it! without removing high fructose fruits, soya and a few other ingredients from the EFI diet I would still not be stable. And if I treated the EFI diet as a rules instead of guidelines I would not have experimented with a probiotic that contains a very small amount milk which over the past four weeks has made yet another remarkable improvement in my IBS symptoms. I will write more about it in a posting I will make later.

Keep up the great posts. However, please ensure you know the facts before you make comments about me and my position on the EFI diet.

Thanks Syl

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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Re: Informative / corrections / different perspective new
      #328914 - 04/26/08 12:22 PM
CarolynC

Reged: 03/11/08
Posts: 108
Loc: Connecticut

What did you mean by:

"limiting the consumption of IF is as beneficial for IBS-C as IBS-D"


Thank you

--------------------
IBS-C with bloating and cramps
occasional type A


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Re: Informative / corrections / different perspective new
      #328916 - 04/26/08 12:39 PM
Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5499
Loc: SK, CANADA

Recent research suggests just as IF can exacerbate IBS-D it can also increase problems for IBS-C. The recommendation is that both IBS-D and IBS-C can benefit from increased consumption of SF and a decrease in IF. I will look for the reference in the next couple of days and post it.


--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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I didn't so much make an assumption... new
      #328921 - 04/26/08 02:49 PM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Quote:

I am a he not a she. It strange how some people on this board make assumptions without checking the facts.




as play the odds. In the absence of any information about your gender (I either haven't seen any or haven't remembered any), I was forced to decide how to refer to you. The traditional English practice is to refer to people of unknown gender as "he". I am somewhat uncomfortable with this practice in all circumstances but it seems particularly unwise on the Diet Board. Since some sources report that as much as 75% of IBS sufferers are women and since the vast majority of posters on the IBS Boards are women, it was more likely you were a woman. I could, of course, have referred to you as "s/he" but this form has never achieved wide-spread acceptance and therefore remains jarring enough to divert attention away from whatever points are being made.



--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Syl... new
      #329008 - 04/28/08 07:38 AM

Unregistered




Syl, did you start taking the Life Start??? Do tell

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Re: Syl... new
      #329009 - 04/28/08 07:50 AM
Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5499
Loc: SK, CANADA

Yes - I will make a full posting in a day or two.

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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I knew it! new
      #329051 - 04/28/08 05:11 PM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

Quote:



I am a he not a she.





I had a very big suspicion of this! But then I thought maybe Syl was Sylvia, you know. Syl have you in the past or present posted at IBSgroup.org?

--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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Re: I knew it! new
      #329058 - 04/28/08 05:39 PM
Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5499
Loc: SK, CANADA

I read a few message on that web site but I have never posted a message.

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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Re: For Wendy2 For Sand and Heather new
      #329066 - 04/29/08 02:48 AM
Claudie

Reged: 12/29/07
Posts: 27
Loc: Australia

I'm the one who said I can eat a very small amount of dairy once a day max, but that cold triggers a bad IBSD episode. That is cold soy icecream or cold soy choc milk. I hate to think what cold dairy would do. I only posted this because others were mentioning eating icecream and I wasn't sure if they had thought about the temperature rather than the food. I had hoped it might help someone else. I'm fairly new here (since Jan 2008) and am following the diet quite strictly, am much better than I have ever been before, on a great probiotic which helps, take 10g of acacia every day and am learning heaps. There are a couple of things on the diet which don't bother me in small quantities but I wouldn't call myself stable yet - it hasn't been long enough to be sure and I am still struggling with anxiety which I think is affecting me the most at the moment.


--------------------
IBS D

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For Claudie new
      #329071 - 04/29/08 06:28 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Yup, yours is the post I was thinking of. I thought it was interesting because I've never been bothered by cold but I'm pretty sure Heather mentions it as a possible problem and I know others who've posted in the past have said they are bothered by it. And - if I remember correctly - you said even a small amount of a cold food would bother you. I do think that was a valuable tip to pass along to others since no one else currently posting seems to be talking about problems caused by very cold foods - or if they are, I've missed it.

I'm glad you're doing so well with Heather's approach and that the probiotics are helping. Anxiety can be really tough and - at least for me - I ended up with anxiety mostly about my IBS which made for a vicious cycle: the worry about it made me more likely to have an attack which made me worry about it more. Have you considered trying the hypno program? It might help with that.

Take care.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Reference as promised new
      #329210 - 05/01/08 02:44 PM
Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5499
Loc: SK, CANADA

Hi CarolynC

A systematic review of 17 randomized controlled trials of fiber supplements in IBS patients published in 2004 found that SF significantly improved a global IBS symptoms, while IF did not. The results suggest that increasing SF intake for all types of IBS may be beneficial.

I hope this helps - Good luck

Reference
Bijkerk, C. J., J. W. M. Muris, J. A. Knottnerus, A. W. Hoes, and N. J. De Wit, 2004: Systematic review: the role of different types of fibre in the treatment of irritable bowel syndrome. Alimentary Pharmacology & Therapeutics
Alimentary Pharmacology & Therapeutics, 19, 245-251



--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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