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My Reservations About The Diet (please comment!)
      #162629 - 03/21/05 09:38 AM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


I am posting this in the hopes that you all will have answers to some of the questions this diet raises for me. I'm about to raise several issues here and perhaps they'd be better as separate threads, but...

I have severe (on disability, sleep a few hours a night b/c of pain, etc.) IBS-C, with intense pain and cramping and ridiculous amounts of gas/bloating. This all started after a severe episode of amoebic dysentary and parasites while I was living in Asia six years ago. Also now dealing with CFIDS and FMS.

1. Processed foods: everything I know about nutrition (which is a fair amount) tells me that the more processed a food is, the more unhealthy it is. Several of the foods (including "staples" like bread, crackers, etc.) are highly processed (and could make my CFIDS and FMS much worse). Sugar is beyond debate in terms of its health destroying properties. How do you all reconcile this?

2. Protein: my doc wants me on 80+ grams of protein/day to increase energy (I'm male, active, 170 lbs.) I'm allergic (ELISA test) to soy and egg whites, and can't tolerate beans/legumes at all. Too much fish/chicken triggers me. I'd like to do protein shakes but wonder what options I have that have no whey or soy.

3. Constipation vs. pain/spasm/gas: eating a lot of bread, rice and SF foods reduces pain/spasms/gas but makes me MORE constipated. Eating cooked veggies, oils, etc. improves BMs but triggers pain/spasms/gas. Has anyone else had the same experience? What have you done about it?

4. Vitamins/minerals/nutrition: My gut is so sensitive right now that I can't tolerate any fruits and vegetables except sweet potatoes, bananas, papayas. I'm concerned I'm not getting the health benefits of eating fruits and veggies. What about "green foods" powders/supplements? Any other solutions?

Thanks for your help. I really want my life back.


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Re: My Reservations About The Diet (please comment!) new
      #162649 - 03/21/05 11:20 AM
atomic rose

Reged: 06/01/04
Posts: 7013
Loc: Maine (IBS-A stable since July '05!)

I'll comment the best I can, but I don't know what CFIDS and FMS are, so forgive me if I give any advice that's out of line.

1. I don't have a good answer for this one. Personally, I don't reconcile anything - I eat what makes my gut feel good, and I really don't give a flying fig about what experts, etc say is "good nutrition". Then again, I don't eat nothing but white-flour products, and I don't have an overly sugary diet. I do choose white rice over brown, because I prefer the taste of it. But I do try to incorporate some more "whole" grains where I can, which is what I suggest if you have issues with the "processed" stuff. Once you start adding insolubles back into your diet, you can try whole wheat bread again - some people here can eat it just fine. Oatmeal, barley, and quinoa are all solubles, and are less processed than white flour. As for sugar, you can avoid that too - there are many people on here who don't consume sugar. (But I'll take issue with sugar's "health-destroying properties", as I've watched my great-grandparents live into their late 90's eating plenty of the stuff.)

2. I've seen rice protein powders in the health food store. I'm not sure how they compare in grams per serving, but that would certainly be an option.

3. I haven't had that experience, so I'll skip this one.

4. I'd say give the supplements a try. If you can tolerate them, keep using them! Many of us do supplement our diets with vitamins or vitamin-containing foods like Luna bars and SpiruTein shakes (both of which do have soy, so they wouldn't be an option for you, but that's just an example). And hang in there... as your gut settles down, you'll be able to digest more and more foods again, and as long as you eat them safely (with plenty of soluble fiber), you'll enjoy a wide range of vegetables again.

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Re: My Reservations About The Diet (please comment!) new
      #162651 - 03/21/05 11:27 AM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

Quote:

I am posting this in the hopes that you all will have answers to some of the questions this diet raises for me. I'm about to raise several issues here and perhaps they'd be better as separate threads, but...

I have severe (on disability, sleep a few hours a night b/c of pain, etc.) IBS-C, with intense pain and cramping and ridiculous amounts of gas/bloating. This all started after a severe episode of amoebic dysentary and parasites while I was living in Asia six years ago. Also now dealing with CFIDS and FMS.

1. Processed foods: everything I know about nutrition (which is a fair amount) tells me that the more processed a food is, the more unhealthy it is. Several of the foods (including "staples" like bread, crackers, etc.) are highly processed (and could make my CFIDS and FMS much worse). Sugar is beyond debate in terms of its health destroying properties. How do you all reconcile this?
Heather recommends breads to be as unprocessed as possible, if you can get bread at a bakery made with good natural flour. I eat a lot of french style bakery bread. A person can always bake and cook their own food, even pasta. Sugar, I don't think sugar destroys your health at all- teeth maybe. Try natural honey etc. No one says you have to eat sugar. In fact several people here do not for other health reasons.
2. Protein: my doc wants me on 80+ grams of protein/day to increase energy (I'm male, active, 170 lbs.) I'm allergic (ELISA test) to soy and egg whites, and can't tolerate beans/legumes at all. Too much fish/chicken triggers me. I'd like to do protein shakes but wonder what options I have that have no whey or soy. I don't know any specifically, I hope someone does. Otehrwise search around. Try to get stable and add back in proteins like chicken/fish as much as possible. Things you can't handle now might be fine later. Research what other foods have protein that you might not be thinking about.

3. Constipation vs. pain/spasm/gas: eating a lot of bread, rice and SF foods reduces pain/spasms/gas but makes me MORE constipated. Eating cooked veggies, oils, etc. improves BMs but triggers pain/spasms/gas. Has anyone else had the same experience? What have you done about it?
I think everyone has this to some extent. There is a balance needed because insolubles and other things are harder to digest and cause cramping (and that is why Heather's diet works) and solubles that are starchy sometimes cause C so you have to find the balance with throwing in good insolubles. Also a SFS is essential!
4. Vitamins/minerals/nutrition: My gut is so sensitive right now that I can't tolerate any fruits and vegetables except sweet potatoes, bananas, papayas. I'm concerned I'm not getting the health benefits of eating fruits and veggies. What about "green foods" powders/supplements? Any other solutions?
I don't know anything about health supplements. You would have to search and find dairy free and natural supplements. Try eating baby food fruits and veggies since they are so digestable. Lots of people find that it takes weeks of bland diet to get on track and that isn't ideal in any way. But take heart, I know someone who lives on bananas and potatoes and says that is all he needs and in Papillion that guy lived on coconuts all those years.
Thanks for your help. I really want my life back.





--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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Re: My Reservations About The Diet (please comment!) new
      #162664 - 03/21/05 12:48 PM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

First, I'm sorry you're having such a terrible time. IBS is enough to deal with by itself - I can imagine how frustrating it must be trying to address three chronic illnesses at once.

I think the other people who have posted have pretty well addressed your specific concerns. What I would add is that you may have to take things one step at a time. In order to get your gut settled, for example, you may not be able to eat all the protein your doctor wants you to just yet. As one of the other posters said, once your gut settles down a little, you should be able to tolerate more chicken, so you can up your protein at that point. In order to get your gut to settle down, you may have to eat more simple carbs than you'd like - rice, bakery white breads, pretzels. Again, once your gut settles down, you can try adding in some whole grain choices.

I know there are other people on the Board who have fibromyalgia (which I assume is what FMS is), so it is possible to find a way of eating that helps both IBS and FMS. I don't know if there's anyone on the Board who also has chronic fatigue, but there are a number of people who eat gluten free, so if wheat is an issue, there are ways around that. As for vitamins and minerals while you're subsisting - temporarily - on rice, sweet potatoes, bananas, and papayas, I take a One-A-Day vitamin and tolerate it well. Again, it's not a perfect solution, but it could get you through this rough patch while you're stabilizing.

PS - Your comment about being allergic to egg whites made me go looking for what my vegan friends use as an egg white substitute and I found this, which you might find interesting, especially the quote from Sharon Tyler Herbst at the very end:

http://www.ochef.com/687.htm

You can check the Recipe Index for recipes you feel you can eat - I know there are at least a couple of gluten free bread recipes out there.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: My Reservations About The Diet (please comment!) new
      #162667 - 03/21/05 01:00 PM
Dia

Reged: 02/04/05
Posts: 175
Loc: Tucson, AZ

Hi,
I can only offer suggestions for questions 1 and 4.

1. I have a bread maker, and it's awsome. The "quick" recipes only take an hour, and I feel so much better about knowing exactly what I'm eating in my bread.

4. Luna bars usually don't bother us IBS-ers. They have quite a few vitamins in there, and I know some people here use them as their daily vitamin.

Also, I think the idea is you have to eat a little "unhealthy" (ie, less veggies) until your body is stable enough to eat things with more protein and vitamins.

Hope this helps,
Myra

--------------------
IBS-D

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Some great answers here! new
      #162677 - 03/21/05 01:25 PM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

Processed food and sugar sure do cause problems for FMS (that's fibro btw everyone! )...I'm trying to cut out sugar atm cos the sugar highs/lows mess with my Fibro so much. I eat very little processed food...lots of fresh fish, veggies and rice/pasta/bread (made at home with no sugar/dairy). Ruchie also has FMS and eats a very naturopathic diet.

BUT...big but...IBS and FMS are so interlinked that getting the IBS under control is a big issue with getting the FMS under control. My IBS is stable now and to do that I ate the foods that made my gut happy...if that included sugary oods then what the heck. I'm only NOW trying to adapt my diet for FMS as the IBS is under control!

And btw, sugar isn't health destroying...too much can be bad for you and it's certainly addictive but it doesn't destroy your health on it's own...unless you allow it to!

Eat protein with SF and you'll tolerate it better. Rice protein shakes are out there, so I'd try one.

And the others have answered on the SF/IF balance and IBS-C issue...re-read the diet guidelines!

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Re: Some great answers here! new
      #162722 - 03/21/05 02:17 PM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


Sincere thanks to everyone who replied. Sounds like it might be necessary for me to eat a very simple diet for a while to stabilize my gut, and only then concern myself with making it more friendly to the other conditions I struggle with. I am aware of the diet guidelines that permit insoluble fiber in small amounts with/after a primarily SF meal, but I'm finding right now that almost any amount of insoluble fiber triggers me. Again, I guess I've just got to accept that for the time being and do whatever I can to stop the spasms/pain/gas/bloating... all of which make my general health much, much worse.

I'll keep you posted and thanks again for your help. It really makes a huge difference.

Chris

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an idea, you don't have to agree new
      #162774 - 03/21/05 05:08 PM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

I personally feel regularity is most important. I feel that bloating/pain can only be under control when the gut is moving along as it should. So I would focus on staying somewhat regular and although pain is no walk in the park, it is more persistant and won't go away without colon stabilization. I would eat what foods are needed for regularity and drink a lot of peppermint/fennel tea and wait it out.

--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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Re: an idea, you don't have to agree new
      #162779 - 03/21/05 05:21 PM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


I agree, and to some extent this has been my experience. However, waiting it out doesn't seem a viable option as I've been doing that for the past six years. I'm not even totally sure IBS is the root of the problems I'm having, though my bowel is most definitely "irritable" - but I'm willing to try this diet and just about anything else that can possibly give me relief.

The pain and spasms are so severe they've prevented me from functioning the past year. I need to find some way to stabilize, fast.

Chris

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Re: an idea, you don't have to agree new
      #162795 - 03/21/05 06:11 PM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

What I mean by waiting it out is giving the diet a chance to work. I know you had said you get C from the stuff that makes you less crampy and so it was sort of a damned if you do...kind of scenario. I think you are more damned staying away from insolubles (only safe ones of course) than the other way around. I hope this makes sense.

--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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Re: My Reservations About The Diet (please comment!) new
      #164049 - 03/25/05 12:45 PM
Alisa

Reged: 03/20/05
Posts: 51
Loc: Appleton, Wisconsin

My heart goes out to you, because you sound just like me! I am an 18-year-old college freshman, and I have IBS-C as well. I have been dealing with my symptoms for over four years now, and it all started with food poisoning from Chinese take-out. Since then, I've been on hundreds of medications, seen hundreds of doctors all over the U.S., undergone several surgical procedures, and tried numerous diets. I also have endometriosis, fibromyalgia, symptoms of Celiac Disease, and have experienced severe weight loss due to my inability to eat because of all the bloating, cramping, nausea, and constipation. I have found that following the celiac diet has helped me immensely in terms of gas and bloating. I also avoid dairy (I have eggs, though), refined sugars, processed foods, and high amounts of oils (canola oil is the easiest oil for me to tolerate and cooking with PAM canola spray is fine, too). Packaged foods are always dangerous for me because of all the mixed ingredients. I find doing my own baking is safe (websites for Celiac patients are very helpful, and I substitute honey and soy milk for sugar and skim milk - I know soy milk would bother you, though, so maybe you could try rice milk). I live on fresh meats, fish, veggies, fruits, rice, and rice/gluten-free flour mixes. Since chicken upsets you, I would suggest turkey breast and maybe tofu. As for veggies, raw veggies do not bother me as long as I don't eat too many. I love baked acorn squash, but if I have too much of it, I'm miserable. It's a lot of trial and error (heavy on the error side). Apples, I have found, bother me as well as high insoluble fiber fruits like raspberries (if eaten in large quantities). Applesauce or apples without their peels are easier to digest and for me to handle (the peel is the part with insoluble fiber). Bananas and grapes, as they are high in sugar, bother me as well. But, raisins seem to be alright if I have them in moderation. I have four tablespoons of ground flaxseed meal a day, and I just received Heather's Acacia Tummy Fiber today (I just had 1/2 tsp and will have another later in the day...I am hopeful it will improve my IBS-C). The flaxseed keeps me "moving," thank goodness, otherwise I have to use phosphosoda (what they use to clean you out for surgical procedures). I HIGHLY recommend flaxseed. DO NOT try rice bran, as it expanded in my colon and caused even more horrible constipation. Even though brown rice is better for you, white rice is lower in insoluble fiber, which is easier for me to tolerate. Are there any veggies, cooked or uncooked, and fruits that don't bother you? You could try vegetable supplement (capsule form) - I tried one and it did cause less constipation. I don't remember the name of the supplement, but it had 12 essential vitamins/extracts or something to that effect of vegetables for people who are missing them from their diets. I hope this information is helpful to you. Please be encouraged that there are others out there, like me, who understand what you are going through. IBS-C is MISERABLE. I've had episodes where I can't breathe because I'm so compacted. The trick is to get "cleaned out" when that happens and to find a regiment to stay consistent after being cleaned out. I've found that with 4 Tablespoons of flaxseed, and now with the acacia fiber, hopefully I'll be on the road to even more regularity. I wish you all the best.

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Even I have to eat IF... new
      #164051 - 03/25/05 12:48 PM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

...and it is my WORST trigger by far. But I'm A so if I don't I get C. I'm just really, really careful...and I was lucky (with regard to this problem) in that when my symptoms were at their worst, they were primarily C so I could cut IF out then.

Good luck. This all tkes alot of time, but feeling better is so worth it.

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Hey, another fibromite! new
      #164052 - 03/25/05 12:50 PM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

Welcome to our group! Our numbers are increasing fast.

Any tips for managing Fibro? I'm ALWAYS on the look out for any new sources of info. How long ago were you diagnosed?

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Re: Hey, another fibromite! new
      #164072 - 03/25/05 01:51 PM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


Unfortunately I don't have any tips (wish I did!). My doc feels this is all related, and that getting the gut back in order will help the fatigue and muscle aches. I'm also very interested in the Body Ecology Diet (mentioned elsewhere in this thread) because of its focus on reestablishing health on a fundamental level. The exploration continues... thanks to all of you for the support and encouragement!

Chris


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question about sugar?? new
      #164084 - 03/25/05 02:52 PM
little bear

Reged: 12/22/04
Posts: 736
Loc: chicago

hello i see you mentioned sugar! and ive been curious...is sugar an IBS[C] trigger? i am using organic natural cane sugar and i only use it in my tea/coffee but for certain teas, in a regular sized mug i was putting about 2 teaspoons. i assumed it would be fine but then started wondering as my C became worse. im still being patient with my diet and i know other things were to blame for the C in the first place, but im trying to cut corners anywhere i can! its making me frazzled i switched to agave sweetener [honey-substitute] but am still wondering for when my agave bottle runs out!! thanks!!

--------------------
VEGAN ASHLEY~IBS/C



www.myspace.com/dutchflowers








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Re: question about sugar?? new
      #164157 - 03/25/05 07:10 PM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

Sugar is one of the few things that is not an IBS problem in any way. Only thing is of course times of possibly eating sugar until you are sick to your stomach like after halloween, but none of us do that!

--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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thanks! new
      #164169 - 03/25/05 07:56 PM
little bear

Reged: 12/22/04
Posts: 736
Loc: chicago

haha i hear yah!
good to know about the sugar!! im glad it wont be a problem! thanKs!

--------------------
VEGAN ASHLEY~IBS/C



www.myspace.com/dutchflowers








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I eat baked squash every day! new
      #164180 - 03/25/05 08:47 PM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

Sometimes twice a day! I wonder if this could be my problem. This is so confusing. Everytime I read something negative about any food, I get scared to eat it! Now, I don't know what to do about my squash. Oh, I am so bummed and confused. I hate all this.

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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As I said... new
      #164236 - 03/26/05 08:10 AM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

...sugar can be a problem for those of us with fibro (FMS) - it is NOT a problem for IBS.

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Re: question about sugar?? new
      #164237 - 03/26/05 08:11 AM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


I know this won't be popular here, but my conscience tells me to post in anyways.

I really cringe when I hear people say "sugar isn't any problem at all". I have over seven years of study, both formal (medical school) and informal, of nutrition and diet. And about the same amount of time living with IBS and related health problems.

Sugar may not trigger a spasm or attack, but it creates a whole range of problems in the body that can certainly make someone with IBS feel worse. For one, sugar can create an "acid" condition (the colon should normally be alkaline) which can lead to constipation, gas, bloating and fatigue. Sugar creates ideal conditions for yeast, parasites and unhealthy bacteria to grow in the gut (as they all feed on sugar/simple carbs). If you've been following IBS research lately you'll be aware that many researchers are establishing a link between these organisms and IBS - they have found that many who've been diagnosed with IBS actually have parasites or bacterial overgrowth, and once these pathogens are treated the "IBS" clears up.

To learn more about sugar's effects on the body, visit this link: http://www.healingdaily.com/detoxification-diet/sugar.htm.

I know most of us feel so restricted already by IBS. It's kind of nice to think, "oh, well at least sugar is no problem". Maybe it won't be for you. But for me, there's more to health than just getting my gut spasms under control. I actually want to create health on a fundamental level.

I know it can be so confusing with so many opinions and philosophies toward health represented here. My belief is that we all have to be our own experts, and that "expertise" can only come through personal experience and exploration. So check it out - do some research on the Net, try eating lots of sugar and see how you feel, try going without sugar and see how you feel... run some experiments.

Hope this is more helpful than confusing...

Chris



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What's wrong with squash? new
      #164239 - 03/26/05 08:12 AM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

It's a pretty darn safe food IMHO...but I guess someone out there is sensitive to EVERYTHING around!

Beth...don't stress about it. You mustn't be scared all of all foods as no food is also bad! But why do you eat the same thing everyday anyway?

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Sugar post new
      #164241 - 03/26/05 08:18 AM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

The problem with posting that is that it's a VERY confusing issue for IBSers. Sugar is NOT an IBS trigger. Definitely not. If you have candida overgrowth or a bacterial infection that is SEPARATE to the IBS and should be cleared up anyway ...these are both things that should be checked for when you are getting a diagnosis. I repeat, candida overrowth and bacterial infections ARE NOT IBS!

HOWEVER...too much sugar isn't great for you. Some of us are more senstive to it than others (like with everything ). SO some people can eat a mountain of candy and sugary stuff a day, like to 90 and no health issues...others (like me b/c of my Fibro) get very tired from just one bar of chocolate! It depends. For the vast majority of people it's absolutely fine as a condiment and in a few foods.

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Re: question about sugar?? new
      #164252 - 03/26/05 09:06 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Sugar seems to be becoming a somewhat volatile topic on the Board, so I was glad to see you say that we must all be our own experts. That certainly fits in with the advice I often see here to "listen to your gut". I don't think the correct test, though, is between eating lots of sugar and eating no sugar. "All things in moderation" is a good rule for most of life. I certainly don't think anyone will be harmed physically by eliminating sugar. Neither, however, do I think anyone will be harmed by consuming a reasonable amount of it.

My belief is that the real problem with sugar is that it can drive out foods that contain nutrients. In other words, in order to consume large amounts of sugar without becoming terribly obese, the consumer must give up eating other foods that provide vitamins, mineral, protein, and just about everything else the body needs. Keeping sugar to a moderate level allows room for those nutrients while satisfying a sweet tooth. One can have one's vegetables and eat one's cake, too.

As for IBSers specifically, I think consuming more sugar than might otherwise be considered "reasonable" is competely understandable, especially when first adjusting to the IBS Diet. First, it provides a way to get calories with no risk of triggering an attack. Although I do not have a calorie deficit problem (sigh), a number of people with this condition do. Second, it may well be psychologically important. Because the IBS Diet requires us to give up many familiar and well-loved foods, knowing we can have "treats" may make that process more palatable psychologically. Or as Linz put it more pithily, if sugar is what it takes to get stabilized, then "what the heck".

I could also make the argument that the IBS Diet probably actually cuts down on the amount of sugar we eat, even if we do indulge regularly in "sweet treats". Given the amount of sugar consumed in processed foods on a "normal" diet, cutting out so much of that food quite possibly eliminates more sugar than we add with the sweets consisent with the IBS Diet. As evidence I offer my own triglyceride numbers, which were consistently in the 250-300 range before beginning this diet and stood at 157 in January. And believe me when I tell you, I definitely indulge in sweet treats.

As for yeast, parasites, and unhealthy bacteria, I have not seen a discussion of yeast infections being a factor in, or masquerading as, IBS. I know parasitical infection can be mistaken for IBS, but as Linz says, that's a separate issue and can be resolved by appropriate testing and treatment.

When I first read about the possible relationship between bacterial overgrowth and IBS, I was quite taken with the idea, but later investigation made me less enthusiastic. My understanding is that this theory rests on a retrospective study of patients seen by physicians other than the bacterial overgrowth researchers. Because this was a retrospective study, it lacks the design and controls necessary to insure its usefulness. If there is a more carefully designed study on this, I would really like to see it.

I'm not sure how much of a sense of humor everyone has about this issue - sometimes I'm not sure how much of a sense of humor I have about it, but here's a quote that never fails to make me chuckle. I hope everyone else has the same reaction:

Just think of all those women on the Titanic who said, "No, thank you," to dessert that night. And for what! - Erma Bombeck


--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: question about sugar?? new
      #164266 - 03/26/05 11:36 AM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


If eating sugar makes people feel better, and not worse, then I'm all for saying "what the heck". That's why I always advocate experimenting and discovering what works for each unique body.

FYI parasitic infections are NOT necessarily easy to diagnose or treat, and therefore it's not always clear whether the symptoms one is experiencing are IBS or something else. In my case, I had SEVEN negative stool test results before finally testing positive for Giardia and E. Histolytica. I've had several treatments over the course of six years and, though recent stool tests have been negative, based on my current health status and previous experience with false negative test results I'm not at all convinced I'm free of these bugs. Western medicine is still quite primitive in this arena.

So... if someone is dutifully following the guidelines of this diet and not seeing any improvement, and things like sugar tend to make them feel much worse, it could be a sign there is something else going on.

In my case, if I eat mostly SF (bread, rice, pasta, etc), the pain/cramps/spasms are reduced but I feel like I got hit by a truck, the constipation worsens dramatically, and I can hardly function. So clearly there's more to it than "IBS", which is by the way a very non-specific diagnosis in the first place.

FWIW...

Chris

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I kind of agree... new
      #164274 - 03/26/05 12:17 PM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

...at least about if the diet really doesn't work, then people should reconsider if it IS really IBS - this is often the point at which different problems are diagnosed.

HOWEVER, eating for IBS isn't as simple as just eating SF! That can help if you only have D and cramps, but many, many people are either A or C. So if just eating SF doesn't solve all your problems that doesn't mean it's not just IBS! I just have IBS (in terms of GI issues) and I have to get IF or I get C...but if I have too much or eat it not safely, then I can get anything from D to gas!

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Re: question about sugar?? new
      #164279 - 03/26/05 01:36 PM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Like Linz, I agree that if one follows this diet and the symptoms aren't responding - or are worsening - other possibilities should be explored. IBS is a diagnosis of exclusion, so it's always open to some question.

I do believe, though, that there is something - or possibly more than one something - that is a digestive problem apart from parasites and bacteria, resulting somehow from problems with the gut's nervous system and/or the connection between the gut's nervous system and the brain's. I don't know if you've run across "The Second Brain" by Micahel D. Gershon yet, but I highly recommend it. I struggled a fair amount with the science, but he writes clearly enough that I felt I got somewhat of a handle on it. With your background, you would have a much easier time of it. I found an article on the Web that seems to summarize some of what he says in his book, but frankly I found it too terminology-dense to follow. You might have better luck:

http://www.hosppract.com/issues/1999/07/gershon.htm

As for parasites, I agree with you there, also. Even the standard, mainline, Quest lab parasite tests state that 3 different stool samples may need to be examined before parasites can be ruled out, so I can certainly believe that tracking them down can be difficult, particularly one like E. Histolytica. And I can certainly understand why you might still think that your IBS-like symptoms could be related to parasites. I would think exactly the same thing in your situation. You might take a look at this thread for a discussion of parasites, IBS, the possible interconnection, and general frustration on getting tested for parasites appropriately.

I had to look up "FWIW", which let me spend a pleasant few minutes reading through my acronym list. IMHBIO () your reminding people that symptom persistence despite following the IBS diet probably means there are other problems at work is quite worthwhile. So is your alert about the possibility of parasites and the difficulty of accurately detecting them.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: I kind of agree... new
      #164283 - 03/26/05 02:47 PM
badlydrawnboy

Reged: 03/01/05
Posts: 111


It's not just that white rice, bread, etc. make me more constipated - it's that I feel severe malaise. To me that indicates a biochemical problem. Even when my gut is quiet (i.e. no spasms, pain or gas) I feel really, really bad.

Again, everyone is different. But I've read enough posts from enough people who are experiencing similar symptoms to my own that I felt obliged to point out the possibility that IBS may not be the only problem (and thus this diet may not be the only solution) for those folks.

Sand, thanks for the links to the gut/brain article. I've been doing a lot of research on this lately but hadn't come across this particular resource.

Chris

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Exactly new
      #164301 - 03/26/05 04:52 PM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

I completely trust what research Heather has done as to what helps and hurts IBS. This is an IBS board of course and we are not specifically qualified to discuss and aid any and all GI problems. Sugar does not bother IBS. A person with IBS does not have anything physically different with their digestive tract. Everything looks like a normal tract but it acts irritably for no reason. Our goal is to treat the digestive tract like a crabby child or wild horse and carefully nudge it into working the best it can. By eating foods that will flow through nicely without causing irritation or contractions we keep it as happy as possible and sugar in all natural forms has never been shown to be detrimental to this. I agree with Sand that this diet can cause a person to eat less sugary and processed foods and all around much healhtier. And the diet can be done without sugar, or wheat, or meat, or eggs etc- it is versatile. Being we cannot have pop or alcohol or bought treats we eat so much better. Today for instance I would have had a big bag of m&ms and a giant rice krispie bar and a sugary pop drink if not for knowing about Heather's diet and since I did not but had only a Luna bar and 1t. of sugar in my tea I think I am doing pretty darn well!

--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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better you than me yuck! new
      #164303 - 03/26/05 04:56 PM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

I used to like it but don't anymore BUT Beth there is nothing wrong with squash. I know it is frustrating to not know why you aren't feeling better and if something is causing problems without knowing it. I have never found anything personally that made a difference to me as to specific food intolerances. Hopefully you don't have any but will stabilize gradually but soon! It could just be that your tract is stubborn and not ready to give up its old ways- like a bad hair cowlick.

--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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Have you considered... new
      #164412 - 03/27/05 08:15 AM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

...gluten sensitivity, thyroid issues (the standard blood test can be inaccurate), Fibromyalgia syndrome, or a viral infection?

All possibilities that sprang to mind in response to the "malaise"!

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thyroid problems new
      #164416 - 03/27/05 08:24 AM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

You mention that the classic blood test for thyroid problems are not always conclusive. My TSH came back okay, but in my gut I feel that I have a problem with my thyroid.I have all the classic symptoms: hair loss, fatigue, weight gain, etc. Plus, it runs in my family.

My doctor is taking my TSH blood test as the only definitive answer that I do not have a problem. Do you know what other test could determine if the thyroid is a problem?

I have read where the blood tests cannot always be an inclusive indicator, but I don't know what other way there is to determine.

Thanks!

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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LOL-yes, like a bad hair cowlick! new
      #164419 - 03/27/05 08:29 AM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

Yes, why should my GI system be any different than me! I am a pretty stubborn person!

I just assumed that everyone must have some triggers and that the only way to get the IBS under control is to figure out what they are. When the person posted that squash made his tummy awful, I immediately became suspect of my eating squash.

Don't we all have some triggers?

And how the heck can you live without squash? I love it in every type! Pumpkin, butternut, etc!

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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I am scared of food new
      #164422 - 03/27/05 08:34 AM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

in general. When I don't seem to be able to get better, I just figure I must be eating something that is not agreeing with me. So, every time I read about someone having a problem with a particular food, I worry about it's effect on me.

I am eating pretty much the same food for breakfast and lunch because I am trying to eat simply and expand slowly. Since I wasn't getting anywhere with eating different foods, I thought it might help to reduce to a type of elimination diet. Problem with this is if a problem food is included in the elimination diet, I will never experience relief because I am eating it everyday.

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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Re: thyroid problems new
      #164424 - 03/27/05 08:36 AM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

I *think* that the regular test usually checks for T4, but the free T3 levels need to be checked out too. Your body can have enuogh of one type but not be converting it into other types properly so you can still have a problem. I'll do some more research. It could well be worth asking your doc EXACTLY which hormones were tested for.

Have you considered CFS or Fibro?

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Thanks, Dr. Linz new
      #164433 - 03/27/05 08:48 AM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

You definately should be awarded an honorery degree in nut health sciences!

Yes, I also suspect Fibro very highly as I have many, many of those symptoms. When I was reading the posts on Fibro, I had like 10 of the symptoms that were listed. I definitely need to get a doctor who is going to take all this seriously. I just don't know how to go about finding one from a list of names off the companies insurance covered approved list! Someone who knows about Fibro, IBS, Gluten intolerance, GERD, and possibly thyroid or ovarian cancer, which someone suggested must be ruled out. I had a gyno exam, and he said my ovaries were okay, but don't know if that would show cancer. I don't know if I had the bloodwork for this done eihter.

I need to ask my current GI to take the Thyroid and ovarian cancer possiblilities seriously. But perhaps this is beyond his specialty. I need a good general practioner.

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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Thyroid thread new
      #164451 - 03/27/05 09:59 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Check out this thread for more info on thyroid problems.

Your GI guy is not the right doc for thyroid. At a minimum, you need a GP or Family Practice physician who can do the whole series of tests. At best, you need an endocrinologist. My endocrinologist does: TSH, T3, T4, and T3 Uptake regularly and did a whole slew of other tests when we were still in the diagnostic stage. Take a look at one of the books mentioned in the thread I referenced above.

Your GI guy is also not your best line of defense on ovarian cancer. Here I'm not too knowledgeable, but my understanding is that if your gyno did an exam, that's your best test. If you're unsure, call your gyno's office, tell him you've been tentatively diagnosed with IBS and that you know you must rule out ovarian cancer, and ask him if the exam(s) he has done are sufficient to do that. If you're young and if you have been suffering from IBS symptoms for a while (rather than having a sudden onset), he'll probably think you're a worrywart, but do it anyhow for your own peace of mind.

I already gave you my thoughts on finding a new doctor - I'm sorry none of them panned out for you. I'm lucky to have a very good Family Practitioner and Endocrinologist, and I have high hopes for the GI guy I saw last month - it's still too soon to be sure about him. He's one of the GIs who can prescribe Lotronex and it occurred to me that looking for GIs who can do that might be a way to find a good one, but I haven't been able to find a list of them on the Web. Maybe somebody else can.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: My Reservations About The Diet (please comment!) new
      #164459 - 03/27/05 10:54 AM
Kandee

Reged: 05/22/03
Posts: 3206
Loc: USA, Southern California

Interesting post!
Quote:

I am posting this in the hopes that you all will have answers to some of the questions this diet raises for me. I'm about to raise several issues here and perhaps they'd be better as separate threads, but...

I have severe (on disability, sleep a few hours a night b/c of pain, etc.) IBS-C, with intense pain and cramping and ridiculous amounts of gas/bloating. This all started after a severe episode of amoebic dysentary and parasites while I was living in Asia six years ago. Also now dealing with CFIDS and FMS. I'm sorry. Having IBS AND CFIDS and FMS is not easy.

1. Processed foods: everything I know about nutrition (which is a fair amount) tells me that the more processed a food is, the more unhealthy it is. Several of the foods (including "staples" like bread, crackers, etc.) are highly processed (and could make my CFIDS and FMS much worse). Sugar is beyond debate in terms of its health destroying properties. How do you all reconcile this?

I know what you mean. It is hard at first to resign yourself to the fact that to be void of pain with eating you must base your meals around a food that is considered high in soluble fiber and often lacking in the nutrients our bodies need, BUT that does not mean you have to avoid all foods that are nutritionally dense. It just means you have to be cautious about the type and form they are in.

From what I know about Fibro and CFS, which is very little--Linz is the expert here----avoidance of wheat can be helpful, in which case there are a host of food that you can eat besides just rice cakes. Look for things made from high protein wheat alternatives....quiona and amaranth and teff are some. Can you tolerate oats? Also, with IBS and Fibro dairy avoidance is a must, but you already know that.


2. Protein: my doc wants me on 80+ grams of protein/day to increase energy (I'm male, active, 170 lbs.) I'm allergic (ELISA test) to soy and egg whites, and can't tolerate beans/legumes at all. Too much fish/chicken triggers me. I'd like to do protein shakes but wonder what options I have that have no whey or soy.

Rice and Pea protein powders are as high in protein as whey or soy powders and make a nice base for fruit smoothies or mixed with a rice or nut milk.

3. Constipation vs. pain/spasm/gas: eating a lot of bread, rice and SF foods reduces pain/spasms/gas but makes me MORE constipated. Eating cooked veggies, oils, etc. improves BMs but triggers pain/spasms/gas. Has anyone else had the same experience? What have you done about it?

For me, besides this diet there are 2 other things I include with every main meal. One is digestive enzymens, another is a probiotic (or homemade DF kefir). Fats, even oils are a main trigger for me not to mention I don't have a gall bladder so don't process fats well anyway. I keep the amount of cooked veggies and fruits as high as I can, always adding a SF before or during consuming those. I also take a SFS before eating, and at night a triple dose of psyllium (Konsyl) plus stool softeners and an apple pectin tab. All that amounts to around 25-35 g. of fiber which is what my body needs. Being hypothyroid I'm also a "C" and so need as much fiber as I can get. I DO NOT avoid antispasmodics altogether and take a Bentyl when I eat out or before eating what I know will be a large meal, thus taking "as needed" but not all the time because it has a tendency to make one "C" as well.

4. Vitamins/minerals/nutrition: My gut is so sensitive right now that I can't tolerate any fruits and vegetables except sweet potatoes, bananas, papayas. That's pretty good, better than some people. I'm concerned I'm not getting the health benefits of eating fruits and veggies. What about "green foods" powders/supplements? Any other solutions? If green foods (powdered supplements) are dairy free and HFCS free and you consume them AFTER some bread or rice I don't see where you'd have a problem.

Have you tried juicing? Many with IBS can tolerated mixed veggie or fruits juiced as long as they have some SF on their tummy first.


Thanks for your help. I really want my life back. Oh, and we want you too as well. Good luck..it's a matter of trial and error, and we're all a little different with what we can tolerate. Kandee





--------------------


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Book, Bland new
      #164466 - 03/27/05 11:22 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

You're quite welcome for the article. I'd still recommend the book, though - believe it or not, it's funny. I figure anyone who can write a book on the enteric nervous system and make me laugh is both very brilliant and just a little bent - my kind of author. Plus the picture of Dr. Gershon on the dust cover is worth the price of admission by itself.

I was sorting through my bookmarks from this Website, trying to figure out why the heck I'd saved some stuff and found this thread about eating bland or what to do when you're sick of eating "what to eat when you can't eat anything". I thought it might give you some ideas.

I just read Kandee's reply to your original post. She's quite something, isn't she?

If your problems are caused by something other than IBS - or in addition to it - I hope you are able to discover what that is and treat it successfully. If IBS is part or all of your problem, then I hope this plan helps you as much as it's helped me. Whatever path is the right one for you, I, too, hope you get your life back - soon.



--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: question about sugar?? new
      #164472 - 03/27/05 11:40 AM
daliatree

Reged: 07/10/04
Posts: 1176
Loc: Manhattan, New York

as a nutritionist and naturopath I absolutely agree with you...absolutely...sugar has moved from being a condiment to being a whole food in our society and its awful!!

--------------------
Feel the fear and do it anyway!


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Re: I kind of agree... new
      #164475 - 03/27/05 11:53 AM
daliatree

Reged: 07/10/04
Posts: 1176
Loc: Manhattan, New York

yep - the white stuff kept my gut more quiet, but much more C and my moods swings and lethargy were terrible...awful...

--------------------
Feel the fear and do it anyway!


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Thanks for the link! new
      #164476 - 03/27/05 11:58 AM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

I'm sorry but I forgot what you suggested about finding a doctor. I searched, but couldn't find you response to this topic.

If you don't mind, could you tell me again? If it was the thread on good IBS docs on this website, there was none listed for Illinois at all.

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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Re: Thanks for the link! new
      #164478 - 03/27/05 12:15 PM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

Here's my post about finding a good doc. I do refer to the thread started by Heather on good docs, but in particular to her idea of finding a good GI guy by checking with IBS hypnotherapists in your area. Here's that particular post .

HTH.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Thanks new
      #164482 - 03/27/05 12:30 PM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

Now that I reread this, it reminded me that I did call a hypnotist for a referral and he never called me back. Time for another call!

BTW, in the old post, you said that you were still researching other possibilities besides IBS. Are you still doing that, or have you come to the conclusion that it is IBS and only IBS?

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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Re: I eat baked squash every day! new
      #164485 - 03/27/05 12:41 PM
Alisa

Reged: 03/20/05
Posts: 51
Loc: Appleton, Wisconsin

Hi Beth,

I actually have the same problem with baked squash lately. I love it so much, but if have it many days in a row, or twice in one day (especially at the same time), I get horribly bloated and am unable to eat anything for the rest of the day. I'm not sure why that happens, but diet rotation is very important with IBS. I found I did the same things with blueberries and am now allergic to them. This is so frustrating!

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Re: question about sugar?? new
      #164486 - 03/27/05 12:46 PM
Alisa

Reged: 03/20/05
Posts: 51
Loc: Appleton, Wisconsin

Hi Chris,

Thank you for this post. It makes me feel so much better to know that other people recognize sugar's negative affect on IBS and digestive health. My nutritionist/dietician I was working with two years ago (I stopped working with her after a month...she was awful. She told me I had an eating disorder and not any physical problem at all!) told me that sugar couldn't be a problem. Well, after eating anything with refined sugar I notice that I'm horribly bloated and unable to eat anything for the rest of the day due to the horrible pain I experience. Obviously, that isn't normal, and avoiding sugar has helped me. I use honey to sweeten things, and I don't crave sweet foods at all anymore. It's better to avoid sugar than to get sick from it!

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Re: Thanks new
      #164497 - 03/27/05 02:15 PM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

I'm not researching anything else. With Heather's diet and acacia, plus use of Bentyl and Immodium as needed, I'm doing much, much better, so my official stance right now is that it's "just" IBS. My GI - bless his heart - is willing to do more testing for parasites if I insist, but he really, really doesn't think anything like that is going on and I'm just not psychologically up for more stool specimens (sorry, probably TMI). Maybe later if my recovery stalls before it gets to a point I consider ideal.

There were a couple of posts that really resonated for me in terms of deciding to spend my energy doing Heather's plan to the fullest rather than continuing to search for some other problem instead of or in addition to the IBS. One was LauraSue's comment about taking meds aggressively rather than reluctantly. The other was this whole thread and particularly KinOz' "I hear you" post within it. I decided to stop beating my head against the wall trying to find another explanation on the Internet or get a doctor to tell me what "else" was wrong, give Heather's plan my full focus and best efforts, and see if it worked. For me, it's worked very, very well.

Fine print: If you've got symptoms that just don't meet the IBS criteria or if you're absolutely convinced there's something else wrong, you need to pursue it. That's part of how BadlyDrawnBoy started this whole thread. Poor man, his original post has grown like Topsy - he probably doesn't even recognize it anymore.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Alisa, you've got a lot on your plate! new
      #164503 - 03/27/05 02:42 PM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

That's a lot for an 18 year old to deal with!

What type of surgical procedures have you had done? Were they for the IBS? That sounds like not so much fun. So after seeing all these doctors, they have diagnosed you with IBS?

What fruits and veggies can you eat? Do you need to cook your fruits and peel all of them? And how the heck did you figure out which ones you could tolerate when the pain is chronic? When I am in pain everyday, it seems impossible to determine which foods are the problem foods and which are the safe ones. It seems like it doesn't matter what I eat,the pain is there. I do know I cannot handle raw lettuce and probably not course brown rice. but not sure yet.

Perhaps the soy milk is a problem for you as well. It can cause cramps and bloat and gas for many. Have you tried rice milk instead? Just a thought.

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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Re: I eat baked squash every day! new
      #164504 - 03/27/05 02:48 PM
Augie

Reged: 10/27/04
Posts: 5807
Loc: Illinois

Actually, I don't know if they are a problem. After reading your post, I started to think that maybe squash might be a problem because of what you said about eating it so much and that's what I do, thinking it was a pretty safe veggie. I am trying to narrow my foods down to see if I can determine a problem food, so that is why I don't rotate my foods. I thought this is what we were suppose to do to figure out triggers. The only problem with that is if you include a possible trigger food in the elimination diet!

Like, I now eat squash and potatoes (in form of sweet potato or Low Fat Kettle Krisp potato chips) everyday, but it either of these is a problem, I would never figure it out because they are in my "safe" diet. This whole thing remains a mess for me.

--------------------
~ Beth
Constipation, pain prodominent,cramps, spasms and bloat!

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Re: LOL-yes, like a bad hair cowlick! new
      #164522 - 03/27/05 05:11 PM
Little Minnie

Reged: 04/16/04
Posts: 4987
Loc: Minnesota

Yep we all have triggers, but that is not to say they are above and beyond the trigger list on this site that Heather has come up with. Those are definite triggers but I don't feel everyone has extra special triggers besides that. I DO think though that we all have some of those that are worse or better for us. Some people, like me, have a very bad, sensitive reaction to fat but not so bad with IF. Yet fat and IF are both triggers for all IBSers to some degree.

Maybe I do have a trigger on top of the normal list but so far I haven't found it. I like my diet the way it is!

(I did think though for years that papaya and mango were allergy foods for me. Papaya went through me once in a few minutes and my mom is allergic to mango. But it turns out they are fine for me. I got D from something other than the mango at that time. (Years ago I took correctol and immodium almost every day! EEK!))

--------------------
IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!

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Re: I am scared of food new
      #164592 - 03/28/05 04:23 AM
melissam

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 308
Loc: Scranton Pennsylvania

I was and sometimes still am that way-
I would eat the same exact food for breakfast lunch and dinner every single day- but I knew that wasn't the greatest thing in the world either. I came to the conclusion that I am going to have cramping pain after I eat all day long no matter what I eat. Obviously I can't sit down and eat a dozen chicken wings - but I do try to add diferent foods in once in a while- If I am going to be in pain no matter what I figure I might as well eat something other than grhama crackers, chicken, applesauce and oatmeal.
I am totally afraid of certain foods- and I was the same way- I would read something that didnt agree with someone on the board and that was it- I WASN'T EATING IT. But then I told myself everyone is different.
And guess what- things have been no worse than they were before and I am eating more things now.


--------------------
Melissa
Pain predominant w/occasional C.

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This sounds very sensible! new
      #164593 - 03/28/05 04:33 AM
Linz

Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 8242
Loc: England

I was terrified of IF for ages (it's my worst trigger by far) but I've got over that - partly by eating it so safely that it doesn't hurt and partly by realising that I'd prefer the occasional meal in my favourite restaurant with the ensuing bloat and cramps, than to never going there again!

Everyone's different as you said so (as Beth's been mentioning recently) you could cut out all the foods other people mention they have problems with to no effect and STILL have your own personal problem foods in your diet! It's tough...this all takes a hell of a lot of time!

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Re: Alisa, you've got a lot on your plate! new
      #164652 - 03/28/05 09:30 AM
Alisa

Reged: 03/20/05
Posts: 51
Loc: Appleton, Wisconsin

Hi Beth,

I do deal with a lot for an 18-year-old, but it makes me a strong, stoic person. It also has kept me strong in my faith, which is very important to me. I have undergone laparoscopy, three endoscopies, four colonoscopies, and have had to have a chest tube put in for a collapsed lung (the lung collapsed after being so dehydrated and having to have a central IV line put in my chest). It hasn't been fun at all. I've been diagnosed with endometriosis, fibromyalgia, IBS (as you know, the common diagnosis for people with insane amounts of digestive issues), and I have self-diagnosed myself with wheat/gluten intolerance (I'm not sure if it's full-blown Celiac Disease, but it sure seems like it). As for fruits, veggies, and other foods I have had allergic reactions (can't breathe, swallow, face/tongue/lips swelling...) to almonds, blueberries, and cherries. I eat raspberries, blackberries, strawberries, apples (peeled or applesauce), and grapes on occasion. I especially like frozen berries on cereal or just by themselves. For veggies, I eat lettuce, carrots, peas, corn (in moderation), acorn squash (now in moderation due to sensitivity), green beans, cauliflower, broccoli, pea pods, baby corn...I think that's about it. I usually have cooked veggies, although I do have raw veggies on salads. It's hard to tell which foods bother me and which foods don't because of the constant pain, but I can judge by the expansion of my abdomen whether or not something bothers me. Also, my pain will increase in severity. My waist will expand up to EIGHT or NINE inches after eating a trigger food. It's awful. What foods can you tolerate? I have tried rice milk, but it has gluten in it, actually, so I still stick to soy milk. Lactaid milk bothers me, so I think soy is my best option. I have homemade soy ice cream, and it doesn't seem to bother me (yet, anyway...). I hope you're feeling better today and that you had a nice Easter!

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Re: I eat baked squash every day! new
      #164653 - 03/28/05 09:32 AM
Alisa

Reged: 03/20/05
Posts: 51
Loc: Appleton, Wisconsin

The whole rotation of the diet idea is a problem for those of us with such restrictive diets to begin with! I find it hard to rotate things accordingly so I don't get sensitive to the foods I can tolerate. It's so frustrating, and being a social person, it's hard to be around other people in social eating situations. Argh!

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