vegetables with the most SF in them
#360475 - 08/21/10 06:36 AM
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which are they? would they be carrots?
I'd like to know if there are veggies out there that I can eat with only chicken and no carbs.
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Susie, born in 1985,
(pseudo-)D and bloating April 2007-December 2010, now stable
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No carbs means means no SF which is not a good. SFs are indigestible carbs with no calories  If you want pure SF buy a soluble fiber supplement such Benefiber available at ASDA, Boots, etc. You can take it with any safe veggie to increase the SF. Well cooked boiled peeled carrots and some squashes are good. Have a look at any of the databases or tables that give values for SF and IF for an estimate. Choose veggies that are low in IF and high in SF. Remember these tables won't give you information about the functional fiber (eg. resistant starch) levels which are also SF.
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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Syl, just read the article in your signature. Question: do you not eat wheat bread then? (or do you eat it in small amounts in conjunction with other foods?) According to the article even white bread may be problematic then, despite it being SF?
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Susie, born in 1985,
(pseudo-)D and bloating April 2007-December 2010, now stable
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Wheat contains fructans which are composed of long chains of fructose molecules. Sensitivity to fructans varies quite a bit from individual to individual. Even though I am very sensitive to foods with excess fructose (i.e. more fructose than glucose) I can tolerate quite a bit of wheat products with no problems. Thank heavens - I love bread, pasta, crackers, etc.
Did you read both articles? The bottom one is the most recent produced by the Australian GI research group which has developed this approach over the past decade. Unfortunately, the web based version of the article is missing the tables with useful information contained in the original article.  Heather's EFI diet is quite similar but with less emphasis on fructose and fructans.
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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Not being a Medscape Member, I can't read that article unfortunately.
Thanks for all your informative answers to my oft-silly questions.
I very rarely eat pasta, but bread is a staple, so would not be very happy if I had to forgo that. Don't want to bore you or any other person on this message board, but my main motivation for trying out this diet is the following. I'm in my mid-twenties and have had IBS-C for 3 years and it has become a lot better over the years, esp as I don't ever eat IF on its own anymore, the worst offender in my case, experience tells me.
The constipation is usually not overly bad, my IBS these days is characterised by irregularity and bloating. I don't actually mind the former that much (esp since I eat very frequently and small amounts so won't be having the kind of bowel movements that normal people have, normal people eat say 3 times per day, I eat 8 times per day. sorry for the explicit detail but pre-IBS with that I did have (back then) perfect bowel movements 3 times a day as opposed to normal people who only go once I imagine).
Anyway the greater evil is bloating/gas, which can be inordinately annoying and I have always been prone to bloating even prior to IBS sometimes! A third problem is the weight issue, I am a girl, mid-twenties and pre-IBS used to have an amazing body (without bragging). Now when I have constipation, since I am quite slim by nature, if there is constipation I can practically see the fat on me immediately, with food retained and my digestion blocked as it were. Maybe I am vain, but this is bothering me intensely as well and I am longing to be as slim as I used to be. As I said it would also be heavenly to get rid of the bloating. That is why I am vowing to strictly enforce this recommended diet, esp when I'm back in the UK and will be entirely cooking for myself again (in mainland Europe now, back with family for the summer). Now I can without problem live with this diet (cutting out bread would be painful however, I'm sure it does not have an adverse effect on my IBS constipation-wise, but since I have the bloating all the time, I can't be sure whether bread causes/contributes to the bloating??), but my other main concern is those cell salts that I'm taking which do contain lactose, even if tiny doses of it. That should go then as well, right? oh sigh, they are for all sorts of problems and help me a lot.
Last question, you say you are stable, that means you don't have any digestive problems as long as you abide by the rules? (which for me sounds ideal, for not having any digestive problems I would give anything in the world. but those cell salt tablets and the 250 mg of lactose in them is not good news, is it?)
thanks for your thoughts in advance, have another question which I shall post in a separate thread
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Susie, born in 1985,
(pseudo-)D and bloating April 2007-December 2010, now stable
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There aren't any silly questions when it comes to managing IBS symptoms Yea - bloating, gas and distention are a big problem for people with IBS. I wish there was a solution to this problem. Dietary approaches can be good for managing but not eliminating this problem.
It worth while removing the cells salts with lactose for a couple of weeks and see if you can tell the difference. Or look for cells salts without lactose.
Stable does not mean no digestive problems. For me it means I can get on with my day without obsessing about IBS because the symptoms are greatly reduced but not gone.
Medscape membership is free. They have a lot of good IBS articles.
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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Here is the list of soluble fiber foods. There are veggies that can be the SF base for a meal so you don't have to eat rice or pasta or bread too. Well-cooked root veggies (lots of choices there), squash, sweet potatoes, potatoes, mushy peas for you in the UK, artichoke hearts. The next level of veggies are somewhat easy to digest but need a SF in addition: well-cooked peas, asparagus, beans, spinach, mushrooms (I can use mushrooms as SF myself). They are veggies I suggest trying after you are used to the more SF veggies. You can always use a SFS as your SF too. Like have a eggwhite omelet with mushrooms and spinach and a cup of tea with acacia in it.
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IBS-A for 20 years with terrible bloating and gas. On the diet since April 2004. Remember this from Heather's information pages:
"You absolutely must eat insoluble fiber foods, and as much as safely possible, but within the IBS dietary guidelines. Treat insoluble fiber foods with suitable caution, and you'll be able to enjoy a wide variety of them, in very healthy quantities, without problem." Please eat IF foods!
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Thanks very much.
The problem is that according to Syl's link : ' Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional Gastrointestinal Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach '
not mushrooms, or beets, or asparagus or artichokes or beans are good for you (classed as problem foods as they are Oligosaccharides (fructans and/or galactans)). What does that link recommend instead: celery and corn and spring onion among others, well those were the best known at any rate, which are even more vicious than 'Oligosaccharides (fructans and/or galactans)' when it comes to my digestive system. Had celery 3 days ago and still cursing, am never ever eating celery ever again.
Seems to me that the only completely safe vegetable for me is carrots. oh sigh. 
Edit: I'm particularly peeved about mushrooms as they are so healthy, but I have always had problems with mushrooms!
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Susie, born in 1985,
(pseudo-)D and bloating April 2007-December 2010, now stable
Edited by CellSalts_Work (08/23/10 02:39 AM)
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You have to be careful interpreting the information in that article. The dietary approach was designed to handle all function GI disorders not just IBS. The approach has to be tailored to handle individual GI disorders with the assistance of an doctor or dietitian. Adjustment of the fiber content in the diet is also left to the physician or dietitian to advise the patient. As it says in the results section of the abstract "However it [the diet] requires expert delivery by a dietitian trained in the diet." Fiber content is not discussed in the article. In the body of the article it says "If adherence was strict, attention may be needed to modify intake of resistant starch and insoluble and soluble fiber. Other dietary triggers such as food chemicals may need to be considered, as should potential factors such as caffeine, fat, meal size and regularity." Celery and corn would not likely be on the safe list for individuals with IBS, for sure not IBS-D. It is best to stick with Heather's SF list when it comes to selecting veggies and fruits for their fiber content.
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STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS
The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS
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Thanks! Celery is not exactly to be recommended for anyone with IBS-C either, it just paralyses everything (in my experience). Heather's diet is certainly commendable when it comes to SF and IF and it certainly is better tailored to my IBS too than the FODMAP approach, because while I have problems from both mushrooms (SF, but problemfood-fodmap-wise) and celery (IF but not problemfood-fodmap-wise), celery is probably a million times worse. But I'm trying to understand my own IBS, and mushrooms do cause me problems as does beetroot. So that's why I assumed that the FODMAP approach is valid for me as well.
That said, that chart says that couscous should be avoided, which for me has worked just like brown rice, ie moves the bowels wonderfully, same style wholewheat bread does for healthy individuals. Talking of bread, again the mind boggles as to why, especially since there is no other type of wholewheat bread/bread with bran in it that does not majorly upset my stomach, but this otherwise atrocious (due to additives and if the price is any indication) type of bread causes me no problems whatsoever and acts on my digestive system like brown rice: http://www.mysupermarket.co.uk/asda-compare-prices/Bread/ASDA_Smartprice_Medium_Sliced_Brown_Bread_800g.html
I have not the faintest idea why though!
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Susie, born in 1985,
(pseudo-)D and bloating April 2007-December 2010, now stable
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