the salt or the anti-spasmodic?
#310609 - 07/06/07 02:01 PM
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badtzjack
Reged: 05/08/07
Posts: 54
Loc: NEW YORK
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hi, there
for the last few days i've noticed the soreness around and below the stomach and in the rectum that i've complained about seems to have let up. i still have stomach upset and some pain, but the soreness (that may be intestinal inflammation) has eased. i don't know if it's because i've cut out salt (which is an irritant to stomach inflammation) or if the antispasmodic has finally started kicking in (i've been taking Donnatal for over 3 weeks) even the last several mornings the bowel movements have not been so bad. the only thing that has salt in it is the PF plain bagels and the little bit of the smart balance light dairy free butter spread, but i imagine that its very tiny.
does anyone believe that salt could be a problem with soreness (that is if you have sorness) or is it the Donnatal?
also, when you urinate, have you noticed that it sets off something such as muscles being pulled, and there is more pain? i think that urinating puts stress on the colon as well.
one more thing: does a fiber supplement of any kind cause stomach upset and may it be wiser to take it with food?
if you have any theories, let me know
thanks!
Edited by jenrebecca34 (07/06/07 02:09 PM)
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On the urinating thing, all the muscles down there are the pelvic floor muscles, and they are definitely related. People with urinary problems can develop something called Pelvic Floor Dysfunction, which can come from not using the muscles naturally (holding it in, pushing it out, etc). I believe intestinal troubles can cause the same thing if it is causing you to keep the muscles too tight or too loose. Straining when using the bathroom is generally not recommended since it can cause muscle problems. I'm not a doctor, but as someone with both bladder problems and IBS, I feel that one can affect the other, especially when muscles are involved.
If it is causing you a lot of pain, definitely talk to your doctor about it! If it is muscle problems, there is a type of physical therapy for it... I had some mild pelvic floor dysfunction due to the bladder issues and did the PT for a while.
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Lisa
IBS-A, Interstitial Cystitis, Migraines
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perhaps it's the tension and stress i am under with IBS that is causing the problems with the muscles when urinating. it does not always happen, but sometimes things seem to trigger more when doing so. even when not urinating, things seem to yank and pull at certain times, and in the rectum as well. i just want the sorness to go away completely, because if i've conquered one thing, then maybe i can find a way to control the rest.
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Either stress or pain can cause you to tense up when urinating. If that's the case, try to practice relaxing when you go. Make sure not to hold it in too long, because that can make it harder to relax when you finally do go. Go when you feel the need to go.
I definitely understand being under stress due to IBS! I've been having a lot of that myself lately.
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Lisa
IBS-A, Interstitial Cystitis, Migraines
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you know, this started exactly when the IBS did. i never had problems with going either way. the IBS started right after i felt sick eating some meatballs, and the headaches, bad nausea, pain in the stomach, loss of appetite, and such came almost a year ago last Sept. this happened just suddenly, not progressive like it seems to occur for most. i'm planning on getting a coloscopy to check out anything that the catscan did not show. it seems odd that it should be BAM!!! just like that. i'm 35 years old and never had a health problem. it never has been a matter of come and go. perhaps i do have something that can be cleared out. i don't know but i'm going to find out.
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What type of bladder issues do you have? I have retention problems and have to push the urine out. Haven't had any other problems from it though.
/Ulrika, IBS-D
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it just sometimes pulls at the muscles painfully, the very same ones below the stomach and near the hips that seem to hurt the intestine, as though the pressure of urinating is somehow connected to the bowels, aggravating them. it also makes the rectum pull too. it's strange, and something i'm going to ask the doctor about. one moment i could be calm, and after i urinate everything is activated. it could be like Elenadragon said, holding it in or pushing it out (having too much to pee out is probably another problem) puts stress on the muscles, and i think the IBS makes a person all the more aware of everything happening in the body.
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It is pretty common for people with IBS to also have bladder symptoms, upper GI symptoms and/or pain during intercourse. It all seems to be connected.
/Ulrika, IBS-D
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I have a bladder condition called Interstitial Cystitis, also known as Painful Bladder Syndome. It is a condition in which the walls of the bladder do not protect against irritating urine as well as they should, which causes pain. My pelvic muscle problems are most likely a result of that condition (tightening due to pain), and thankfully I have my IC symptoms mostly controlled through medication. I had to start with another very restrictive diet for nearly a year before finally getting some relief from medication and being able to ease up on the diet. My IBS symptoms and diagnosis came after my IC diagnosis.
In any case, I wouldn't worry about it being IC. Pelvic muscle problems are probably much more likely with something like IBS, especially if you feel that it is your muscles giving you trouble. If you find that you just can't relax while urinating and the pain continues, I would definitely mention it to your doctor.
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Lisa
IBS-A, Interstitial Cystitis, Migraines
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About IC
#310646 - 07/07/07 04:31 AM
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Ulrika
Reged: 08/20/06
Posts: 581
Loc: Uppsala, Sweden
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Can they always spot IC on cystoscopy or can you have it without an apparent inflammation in the bladder walls? Just wondering. I have pain in my bladder sometimes and I get pain that feels like it's going through the urethra. But I have had a paralysis so it can have something to do with that, plus I have genital area nerve pain which tends to irritate the bladder a bit too. I had a cystoscopy done a few years ago (but had pretty much the same symptoms then) and it was completely normal.
/Ulrika, IBS-D
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Ulrika, did you have a cystoscopy with hydrodistension (they put you under for this) or just a regular cystoscopy (generally done in the doctor's office)? It usually takes the hydrodistension to detect IC except in severe cases. I had a cystoscopy in the doctor's office which was completely normal. I found a new urologist who was able to to diagnose me based on previous tests and my symptoms (no cystoscopy with hydrodistension).
Pain in the urethra is not uncommon with IC. My pain with IC is only in my urethra. It is referred pain from the bladder. I also have pain with intercourse.
If you have not already been to the following site, I recommend http://www.ic-network.com. There is plenty of information about IC and related conditions, forums, and even a list of doctors by region who work with IC. It took me three urologists and lots of my own research to get a diagnosis for myself! However, once I got the diagnosis and was put on Elmiron, the IC med (which takes six months to start working), I started feeling much better.
Let me know if you have any more questions. I remember how frustrated I was trying to figure out what was wrong with me, and I'd be happy to help you any way I can. 
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Lisa
IBS-A, Interstitial Cystitis, Migraines
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Re: About IC
#310654 - 07/07/07 08:33 AM
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Ulrika
Reged: 08/20/06
Posts: 581
Loc: Uppsala, Sweden
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I'm not sure what hydrodistension means? It sounds like pumping in fluid in the bladder to make sure you can see the walls and structures properly. When I had my cystoscopy done I was not put under. However they did fill the bladder with water during the procedure.
Is your pain constant (or was it before you started taking medicine)? I just get this urethra pain sometimes, and it doesn't have to be while urinating. I also get pain across the bladder region after urinating if the bladder has been very full before emptying, but this doesn't happen very often. I have bladder retention from the paralysis I had as a child but my bladder is also a bit sensitive sometimes and wants to contract although there is only little urine in the bladder. If this is an unrelated thing or if it's only because of the nerve pain I have in the genital area I don't know. Does nerve pain tend to be related to IC as well?
For the time being the bladder symptoms are a little annoying sometimes but they don't cause too much problems so I don't think I need treatment for it. I'm just happy as long as the bladder works in a safe way. Am waiting to see if they want to do a pressure check but the urologists I have seen don't think there is any real reason to worry about that. But they might do one just in case anyway since the bladder emptying has become a little more difficult since I got IBS-D and need to keep the bowels so slow due to my sphincter control issues.
/Ulrika, IBS-D
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They fill your bladder with water during a normal cystoscopy to see the bladder walls. However, with a hydrodistension, they fill it with water beyond its normal capacity to stretch the walls. This allows them to see more. They put you under for this because, as I understand it, you would otherwise be screaming in pain. You probably had a regular cystoscopy and not the hydrodistension.
I had pain most of the time, not just when I was urinating. If you have ever had a urinary tract infection, that's what it felt like to me. It's actually what I thought I had until the bacteria culture came back negative, which is not uncommon in IC patients. However, there really isn't a "normal" set of symptoms for IC, which may be why it is so hard to diagnose. The symptoms vary quite a bit... some people don't have urethral pain, just bladder pain, and some people don't have pain at all, just the urge to urinate all the time. I believe some people do have nerve pain, but I don't know for certain.
I'm glad to hear that your symptoms are not too troubling. There are definitely more mild cases of IC and in most cases it is not progressive, so even if it is IC, you may not need anything for it ever. One thing you may want to keep track of is your diet. IC bladders tend to get irritated by acidic foods such as citris, coffee, vinegar, chocolate, etc (these are the most irritating). Many of these are GI irritants anyway, so you're probably avoiding them already. But it could be helpful to notice if your symptoms get worse after anything you eat or drink.
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Lisa
IBS-A, Interstitial Cystitis, Migraines
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Re: About IC
#310659 - 07/07/07 10:05 AM
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Ulrika
Reged: 08/20/06
Posts: 581
Loc: Uppsala, Sweden
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Thanks for the info. You're right - I am avoiding acidic food pretty much already since I get heartburn and stomach ache from it.
/Ulrika, IBS-D
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