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Re:Anxiety new
      #287360 - 10/21/06 12:48 PM
Susie2

Reged: 08/07/06
Posts: 158
Loc: Pomona California

I so agree with you that anxiety over food can be a bigger IBS trigger than any one specific food. My GI does not deal with diet per se. Fiber and water yes, but unless someone tests specifically for celiac or whatever, he says there is no scientific evidence that diet is the culprit in IBS. And he says he is a scientist and goes with the scientific evidence. Before everybody jumps on this, I want to say, he is a great GI and I have been to several. He treats his patients with dignity and respect. He does not overbook so you are not faced with a waiting room full of patients. He first has you come into his office and sit down and discuss what is going on. Next he leads you to an exam room, gives you a gown and privacy to change. Then he returns with his nurse. After the exam, he has you come back to his office. Unfortunately, he is not taking new patients.

But back to the anxiety issue. I think fear, which leads to anxiety and then often depression, is the biggest crippler of all. I love what your therapist said, you are "a person with anxiety". So much better than saying you are an anxious person. You learn to deal with it and to function with the symptoms of anxiety or depression. It took me soooooo many years to learn this. And the more you function, the less the symptoms will bother you. I too believe that medications can help tremendously, but really work best if coupled with changes in behavior and thoughts.

I know how hard it is to go out there when you are doubled over in pain and worried of having a bowel accident. I have poorly functioning sphincters and have had some unpleasant "accidents." I've limited some of things I do - like leading tours at my botanic garden - because I can't just leave a group of kids and go trotting off to the bathroom, but I try to do as much as I can. I also have arthritis and fibro and don't always feel too well. But I feel a lot worse if I sit home. I then tend to dwell on every little symptom, every ache or pain I feel. I have learned that I can't always change what is going on but I can change my attitude toward it. Like you say, "the only thing to do is learn how to cope." I think that it is great that you have discovered this at your age. thanks for sharing your success with us. Hope I don't sound too preachy but I too think people on these boards get a bit reactive and critical at times when all we are trying to do is share our experiences and offer some support and hope.

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Jordy new
      #287382 - 10/21/06 05:29 PM
Tinkerbelle

Reged: 04/17/05
Posts: 231
Loc: Los Angeles, CA

I urge you to try and find things you enjoy/LOVE... that is the number one stress reliever. Not meditation, yoga all that "serious" stuff... but FUN!!! I don't believe that there isn't a single thing you can think of... What about from the past, from before all these issues were bringing you down... what made you happy? Can you do any of those things now, if even on a small level?

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Re: Yowza! new
      #287384 - 10/21/06 05:42 PM
Lumiere

Reged: 06/30/06
Posts: 141
Loc: New England

Tinkerbelle... Your post contained alot of info that I have come across myself...for one, ayurvedic medicine, and your openness to examining other culture's offerings when it comes to health. I am not a big fan of the biomedical (Western) model, and have always sought out other avenues for health. Some have worked, some work for others. I also believe ANXIETY is a major obstacle to IBS, and to many is a great contributor. Maybe that's why more women are living with it...(an entirely new can of worms!) I know hormones play a big part too, but I commend you for coming forward. I think most people are very supportive on the site, and sometimes posts and info comes across as angry or self-righteous, but I don't think it's meant that way. Remember--we can't hear each other or see our body language which really limits in our interpretation of the words written down. These boards are always open for friendly discussion ...as many of us, myself included, genuinely value yours!!! Keep it coming!

--------------------
Amy
IBS-A
Stable and thankful!


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Re: To Jordy !!!!!!!!!! new
      #287385 - 10/21/06 05:44 PM
Lumiere

Reged: 06/30/06
Posts: 141
Loc: New England

Yes, I second that! We are here for you, Jordy. If there is anything we can conceiveably do to help you get "out there," just ask...I too have felt isolated and alienated. It doesn't have to be this way. Hugs!

--------------------
Amy
IBS-A
Stable and thankful!


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This is not exactly a first amendment issue (m) new
      #287406 - 10/21/06 08:47 PM
jen1013

Reged: 05/06/05
Posts: 1322
Loc: the wabe

Heather established these message boards to discuss her diet. One of the main principles of the diet is that dairy is a huge trigger and should be avoided.

If ghee honestly doesn't bother you -- that's wonderful. BUT, for the vast majority of people, dairy is basically poison. Starting a new thread exhorting the virtues of a dairy product only causes confusion for people who are still new at the diet.

Yes, our bodies are all different and we all ultimately have to find our own way ... and yes, that might not be Heather's way. But that isn't the issue here. The issue is about respecting the boundaries of this board. And claiming that something is helpful for IBS when it is actually completely counter-productive to the guidelines of the diet is not respectful.

I do agree that anxiety can play a huge role in IBS -- this has been brought up many times before and it's something that Heather also covers in her books. But the triggers are triggers because they are hard on the gut. No matter how anxiety-free you are, this does not make the proteins in red meat any less difficult to digest. Some people might be lucky enough to handle these triggers -- most of us aren't.

And if you're one of those lucky ones, that's great -- and I'm glad that you're doing so much better. But, the IBS diet board just really isn't an appropriate place to talk about how helpful a dairy product is. If you perceive any hostility or criticism in the original responses, that's why.

--------------------
jen

"It's one of the most serious things that can possibly happen to one in a battle -- to get one's head cut off." -- LC

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Re: This is not exactly a first amendment issue (m) new
      #287423 - 10/22/06 01:43 AM
Tinkerbelle

Reged: 04/17/05
Posts: 231
Loc: Los Angeles, CA

Hi Jen,
Thanks for your response, I appreciate all the different perspectives that this post is inspiring.
I don't mean to confuse people who are new to the diet. In a way, I am talking to myself when I was new to the diet-when I really limited my food and calorie intake and lost a lot of weight because this board scared me into not eating all types of food. I am prone to anxiety so I take responsibility for the fear that I got from reading these posts... But what I was trying to do was open up different perspectives for people who may be reading this and losing weight or freaking out as I was.
From reading I have done, as I said before, Ghee is supposed to be really easy to digest and help people put on weight and also aide in vatta imbalance (anxiety, etc). So I was just putting it out there as an alternative... and apparently it has not lactose in it, however I guess it's still dairy but it doesn't need to be refrigerated...
Not everyone with IBS is totally lactose intollerant, or fat intollerant. We need fat in our diets to survive. I know this board does not promote many kinds of fats. My IBS was never bad enough that all fats made me sick... maybe at some point it was but now I just can't tolerate "bad" fats, like fried foods, lower qulaitiy oils, too much dairy (ghee not included), basically anything really heavy and greasy... but I do just great with Ghee, olive oils, avocados, and a small amount of cheese....
I guess my main point, after this long winded post, is just for people to listen to the diet, but also to listen to their bodies, and try things in small amounts to see how they react to it... we can't take anything 100 percent.. there is no cure all answer for anyone.... our bodies and experiences are our only truths.

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Just fun?? new
      #287424 - 10/22/06 02:51 AM
Double J

Reged: 03/09/06
Posts: 900
Loc: High Rocky Mountains ibs-d

So you are saying that all I need to do is to have "FUN"?
I can skip the meditation, and yoga exercises, get up on my horse and go fishing, and just have "fun"?

Well ... you see if I did that I would have to quit work, leave the church, get rid of my wife, and abandon my children & grandchildren. Those are all stress points in my life, and I think that I would like to have them all around for a few more years. Those are the things that I love and enjoy.



--------------------
Courage doesn’t always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, “I will try again tomorrow”. Mary Anne Radmacher

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Re: Yowza! new
      #287438 - 10/22/06 09:48 AM
Sand

Reged: 12/13/04
Posts: 4490
Loc: West Orange, NJ (IBS-D)

First, I absolutely agree with you that anxiety over food makes our digestive problems worse. When we constantly fret over very single food choice and worry that we haven't figured out the perfect eating plan, I think we do make our IBS worse. There is a lot to be said for just trying foods - if your body hates them you'll hear about it.

At the same time, however, this Board exists to provide support and information for people who want to follow Heather's Eating For IBS Diet because we believe that approach provides a good shot at getting our IBS under enough control so we can live relatively normal, reasonably productive lives.

To me that means that when someone on the Board says that dairy or egg yolks or red meat or high fat foods or MSG or caffeine or alcohol is fine for her IBS - or even good for her IBS - someone else needs to speak up and say, "Not under this eating program" or "Not for most IBSers" or "This just killed me." I don't think there's anything wrong with the first person saying the food has helped her but I think if no one posts the EFI side of the matter then this Board loses its effectiveness and becomes simply another IBS Board where anything goes and all approaches are considered equally effective.

So if you post that ghee is great for your IBS and no one else says boo, I'm going to step up and say that fat is a brutal IBS trigger for most people and that under the EFI approach all dairy is considered a trigger whether it has lactose or not. I hope I'll do it respectfully and perhaps even with a little humor, but I know that won't always be the case. After all, someone has to have the misfortune to be the 93rd person that day who suggested eating dairy.

I'm pretty rigid about this but it's not because I think the EFI Diet is - or claims to be - the "only effective answer". I know there are people for whom the EFI approach doesn't work. I know there are people who report that other approaches have worked. But here on this Board I believe it's important to maintain focus, to re-emphasize that if someone is going to try the EFI approach she needs to try if full-on. Otherwise, how can she ever truly know whether it will work?

You see, while I agree with you that angsting over food makes our IBS worse, I don't think that anxiety is a function of following the EFI Diet - I think people bring that with them to the Diet. It's understandable for people with IBS. After all, food has been an enemy for a long, long time. Heather's approach doesn't create the anxiety. Rather it provides a framework to reduce the anxiety. The EFI Diet is simply not that complicated: avoid trigger foods, base each meal and snack on a food from the Soluble Fiber foods list; eat safe proteins; and eat as much Insoluble Fiber as you can handle. This is not rocket science.

So when I say people should skip the anxiety step and just try foods, I don't mean trigger foods. What I mean is don't agonize over whether an apple is too much IF or too little. Don't lie awake at night worrying about whether you should eat one tablespoon of cooked spinach or two. Don't fret over green grapes versus red grapes, oranges versus grapefruits, pears versus peaches, pasta versus rice, sweet potatoes versus white potatoes, Yukon Golds versus Russets. Just try stuff. If your body doesn't like it, you'll hear about it.

One final thought about anxiety. As wonderful as the Diet Board is, I also believe that for some people it's a huge source of anxiety. Anyone who is agonizing over food choices should probably stop reading the Boards for a while and go back to the Website outside the Boards and Heather's books for a refresher course on just how straightforward the EFI Diet principles are. It's just way too nitpicky in here sometimes.

--------------------
[Research tells us fourteen out of any ten individuals likes chocolate. - Sandra Boynton]

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Re: Tinkerbelle-Anxiety new
      #287449 - 10/22/06 11:19 AM
feelinggood

Reged: 09/11/06
Posts: 745


Hello,

I have to agree with you that when I myself first read over this site I was scared out of my wits about eating anything - not what is probably intended but being an anxious person I then became afraid of any IF fibre and most fats. I finally had to force myself to introduce IF and good omega 3,6,9 oils. Getting better.
Anxiety - Horrible and crippling thing that anxiety can be - It gives me good hope to read that you are better at dealing with your anxiety and that I can come away from that awful feeling of lonliness and fear - thanks for sharing your story, Debbie IBS-A

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Yuck! new
      #287500 - 10/23/06 03:02 AM
Double J

Reged: 03/09/06
Posts: 900
Loc: High Rocky Mountains ibs-d

I looked up ghee ... it seems to be nasty stuff for those with ibs. "Ghee is composed almost entirely of saturated fat." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghee

--------------------
Courage doesn’t always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, “I will try again tomorrow”. Mary Anne Radmacher

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