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weo

Reged: 12/09/11
Posts: 9
Additional question to 'IBS"?
      #366583 - 12/22/11 09:27 AM

I seem to have some of the symptoms,(pain, bloating,stomach aches) but no real bad C or D. If anything a bit of C from time to time. Must IBS include a significant amount of C or D to be truely considered IBS? Also, I should add that stress seems to be a trigger for Side Pain. More so than food.
Any help would be welcome, Thanks.

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366584 - 12/22/11 10:36 AM

C or D are not necessary conditions for diagnosing IBS. Pain is likely a more significant indicator.

The ROME III diagnostic criteria for Function GI disorder defines IBS as follows:

C1. Irritable Bowel Syndrome Diagnostic criterion*

Recurrent abdominal pain or discomfort** at least 3 days/month in the last 3 months associated with two or more of the following:

1. Improvement with defecation
2. Onset associated with a change in frequency of stool
3. Onset associated with a change in form (appearance) of stool
* Criterion fulfilled for the last 3 months with symptom onset at least 6 months prior to diagnosis
** “Discomfort” means an uncomfortable sensation not described as pain.

In pathophysiology research and clinical trials, a pain/discomfort frequency of at least 2 days a week during screening evaluation is recommended for subject eligibility.

Stress is a well-known and recognised IBS trigger. For some people is can be a bigger trigger than foods.

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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weo

Reged: 12/09/11
Posts: 9
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366586 - 12/22/11 12:03 PM

3 days a week! I wish. My pain is constant. Thanks for your response.
weo

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366587 - 12/22/11 12:13 PM

My pain is in the lower right quadrant. It is constant all waking hours. I have had it for decades. It is a darn nusiance AND it takes a lot of brain power to ignore it

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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weo

Reged: 12/09/11
Posts: 9
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366589 - 12/22/11 03:04 PM

Wow sounds familiar. Did you see my long message /reply back to your questions from a previous posting? I would like your thoughts if any. Thanks so much.By the way, do the teas and pepermint tabs do anything for you?
weo

Edited by weo (12/22/11 03:06 PM)

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capricorn1942

Reged: 10/06/03
Posts: 248
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366590 - 12/23/11 06:52 AM

I appreciate your candor. Sometimes I think I must be doing something wrong with all of this pain. My pain is primarily on the left side from my rectum up, is constant and wakes me from sleep several times a night.

I have seen several of your posts saying you have pain on your right side but this is the first on your left side. Has something changed? How does Fodmaps effect pain for you?

Cheers.

--------------------
ibs-d (pseudo)with pain and bloating

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366591 - 12/23/11 07:07 AM

Ooops - that was a typo - I changed it - Thank you for bring it to my attention My pain is in the lower right quadrant just at the beginning of the ascending colon. When I get a bad attach spasms continue up the ascending colon and sometimes along the transverse colon. The pain right at the start of the ascending colon never seems to leave but it does get less intense if I am careful.

The two factors that gave me the most reduction in pain were (1) dramatic reduction in consumption of insoluble fiber and (2) the elimination of specific FODMAPs - excess fructose, lactose, galactans (particularly soy) and polyols. Fructans don't seem to be a problem.




--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366592 - 12/23/11 07:15 AM

As Capricorn1942 pointed out I made a mistake and said my pain was in the left side when in fact it is the right side. I have corrected my previous post.

I saw you previous post. The only thing that comes to mind is to ask if you have tried eliminating some FODMAPs from your diet. Check the first two links in my signature for details. This approach has been clinically tested for a variety of functional GI disorders with very good results. Unfortunately, this diet does not deal with other triggers such as insoluble fiber, coffee, tea, fat, etc which Heather deals with. It is assumed that your healthcare professional will advise you about these foods. Unfortunately, very few GI docs or GPs give this kind of advice.

Teas and peppermint caps have not helped me. I have tried them a number of times with no particular positive results.

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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shelgirl

Reged: 09/22/09
Posts: 196
Loc: Wisconsin
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366593 - 12/23/11 07:23 AM

Does anyone have pain that includes your lower back? My pain is lower front and back and moves to the left side often. I have been eating a banana a day but now am wondering if this is causing more problems....I see they are on the "friendly" side of the Fodmap chart but wondering about the fiber content?

--------------------
IBS-D. Eating gluten and dairy free.

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366594 - 12/23/11 07:46 AM

You might find the presentation by Dr. Palsson from UNC on IBS and Beyond: Why do some many IBS patients have so many non-gastrointestinal symptoms and What are the impact of these symptoms. Back pain is one of the top 7 common non-GI symptom experienced by individuals with IBS.

Yes - you have to be careful of the insoluble fiber in the FODMAP friendly foods. The FODMAP approach does not deal with other triggers such as fat, coffee, tea, insoluble fiber, etc. It is left up to you doctor to discuss these with you which rarely happens. So you have to blend the EFI and FODMAP approaches to suit your needs.


--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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shelgirl

Reged: 09/22/09
Posts: 196
Loc: Wisconsin
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366595 - 12/23/11 08:37 AM

Thanks...will check that link out. Yes, doctors have been absolutely no help unfortunately.

It's just very confusing. Other than the banana, the only other fiber I've been eating is some cooked carrots...and I thought they were ok for me too...It always seems like I'm "back to square one" again

Do you think a fruit/veggie can be ok for awhile and then suddenly cause problems? It seems like there are so many variables...so frustrating.

--------------------
IBS-D. Eating gluten and dairy free.

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366596 - 12/23/11 08:44 AM

I eat well cooked peeled carrots with no problems. I might be helpful if you listed meals and snacks you have eaten in the past 2-3 days. It might give us some clues to give you some advice.

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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shelgirl

Reged: 09/22/09
Posts: 196
Loc: Wisconsin
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366597 - 12/23/11 10:13 AM

I pretty much eat the same thing everyday.

Breakfast: rice krispies with a whole banana cut up in cereal with a little coconut or almond milk...sometimes I will eat cream of rice cereal.

Lunch: Soup that I make....broth from turkey or chicken, peeled, well cooked carrots(maybe 1/2 cup) and turkey or chicken cut up. 2-3 slices of gluten free bread toasted, sometimes I will put a little olive oil on the toast otherwise just plain. I have tried nitrate free lunch meat on bread but that seems to give me major gas so quit that.

Dinner: Peeled potatoes, chicken, turkey or fish...sometimes white rice or pasta in place of potatoes.

Snacks: Rice crackers, coconut milk yogurt, baked chips

I take an Enzymatic Therapy regular probiotic (I think it just is acidophilus), also a B12 and a multi mineral before bed. I also take Complegest enzyme with each meal. I have tried apple cider vinegar in water also on occasion for digestion.

I know the coconut milk/yogurt is higher in fat but I have been eating it for quite awhile and up till now didn't seem to cause me any problems? The bananas vary of course...sometimes more ripe than not depending on how they ripen...also size sometimes small, sometimes larger. Sometimes I will use canned julienne cut carrots if I don't have time to cook regular carrots. The only other thing I question is the broth...I cook the chicken or turkey with water to make the broth...wondering about the fat content in that?

After awhile I swear I drive myself half crazy trying to figure this all out!

--------------------
IBS-D. Eating gluten and dairy free.

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366598 - 12/23/11 11:03 AM

A couple of questions.

What brand is the rice krispies?

Are the rice crackers made from brown rice?

Afer you make the broth do you put in the fridge/freezer, let the fat congeal and then remove for the top?

I use low fat coconut milk with no ill effects. Generally speaking you should be able to handle about 20-25% of calories in the form of fats/oils.

I have found the canned carrots are not very well cooked - they are still quite crunchy. Do you cook then until soft?

Have you tried the GUT directed hypnotherapy CDs?

--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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shelgirl

Reged: 09/22/09
Posts: 196
Loc: Wisconsin
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366599 - 12/23/11 04:29 PM

Rice crispies are Erewhon brand and yes made of brown rice but very low fiber. Would just the fact that they are brown rice be an issue?

The crackers(Blue Diamond nut thins) just say rice flour, but, have almonds I think in them.

I have not cooked the canned carrots....that might be an issue.

Most often I try to take the top layer of fat off the broth. I've noticed though that sometimes there is a slight gel consistency to the broth (I'm assuming that is from fat too?).

I haven't tried the hypnotherapy but that too is a great idea. As always, thanks for your suggestions.

--------------------
IBS-D. Eating gluten and dairy free.

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Syl

Reged: 03/13/05
Posts: 5394
Loc: SK, CANADA
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366600 - 12/24/11 06:26 AM

The brown rice in the rice cripies can be a problem. Brown rice is a whole grain cereal. Try a plain white rice cereal or a white rice porridge but check the ingredients to make sure it doesn't contain high fructose corn syrup. Have you tried regular oatmeal?

Blue Diamond nut thins have about 3.5% fiber of which almonds add considerably to the insoluble fiber content.

The gel in the broth is ok. It isn't fat. The fat floats on the top so it can be skimmed off.

Many people have good success with the hypno CDs.


--------------------
STABLE: ♂, IBS-D 50+ years - Science of IBS

The FODMAP Approach to Managing IBS Symptoms
Evidence-based Dietary Management of Functional GI Symptoms: The FODMAP Approach
FODMAP Chart & Cheatsheet
The Role of Food & Dietary Intervention in IBS

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shelgirl

Reged: 09/22/09
Posts: 196
Loc: Wisconsin
Re: Additional question to 'IBS"? new
      #366602 - 12/24/11 12:01 PM

Oatmeal has always been a trigger for me unfortunately. Will have to check out plain rice cereals. Thanks again.

--------------------
IBS-D. Eating gluten and dairy free.

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Susie1985

Reged: 05/04/11
Posts: 211
only rolled oats! new
      #366604 - 12/26/11 11:18 PM

I think it really comes down to the individual, but for me excess IF is not so much a problem when it comes from veggies, but usually gives me spasms the kind Syl described when it comes from wholegrains. Oatmeal I tolerate really well, but it can't be wholegrain oats! Only rolled oats, with around 8g fibre per 100g. A lot of porridge has the bran in it. Even when the package indicates that it's still the same amount of IF and SF apparently, I still have D and pain. So it should not be wholegrain oats but rolled oats.

I get a lot of pain from too much fat, although that comes in bouts instead of it being a dull pain, it is extremely sharp and acute. Buscopan helps me there: http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/medicines/100000395.html

Hot peppermint tea reduces the bloating beautifully. Actually the only thing that really works for the bloating. Fennel tea does nothing for me. Peppermint capsules I can't take cos my mouth tastes pepperminty the entire day afterwards no matter how I take it.

--------------------
now: stable through EFI+FODMAP dieting (no lactose/no fructose/some fructans and some polyols)

before: IBS-D(pseudo-diarrhoea), bloating, often unbearable pain esp from too much fat: Apr 2007- Dec 2010


FODMAPs: http://www.todaysdietitian.com/newarchives/072710p30.shtml


[I've tried VSL#3 -> I could tolerate v good amounts of IF (even with less SF), it worked great (but overall I find it too expensive)]

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